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A/C system for engine swap


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BNBSTANG
Novice

Jun 23, 2016, 4:04 PM

Post #1 of 14 (500 views)
A/C system for engine swap Sign In

I've got an 83 K20 that used to be a J code diesel. Now it has a Gen1 small block 350, with a newer 96+ Vortec top end on it. As well as the serpentine belt system. It used to have the giant A6 compressor in it and now it has the HT-6, I still have the original condenser, evaporator, and accumulator in it. I purchased a Vintage air 34108 that will bolt onto the HT6 compressor for new lines, but I'm wondering if I need to change out the accumulator to match the compressor, I need to purchase a line kit from vintage air, which I have no idea as I don't have a line fitting compressor, I also was told since there's no oil in the system I will need 8oz. PAG150? I know I need to get my lines hooked up but I'm just wondering if there's anything else I should know since I'm converting from R-12, to 134a? Is there a different orifice tube I should be using? I'm starting from scratch basically so I really could use some help here. if anybody can help me out I'd appreciate it. As I got some ridiculous quotes and I'm more than capable of doing this.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jun 23, 2016, 4:24 PM

Post #2 of 14 (496 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

I see no reason to change to a different accumulator or Orifice tube. The compressor wasn't engineered for the system in the first place so the whole project has to be trial and error. Keeping the same components should keep the charge spec the same before the refrigerant change.

The biggest issue here will be the retrofit to R134. That will reduce the charge capacity by about 20%. You may also need more cooling fan.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Jun 23, 2016, 4:25 PM)


Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jun 23, 2016, 5:22 PM

Post #3 of 14 (489 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Wouldn't Vintage Air be able to answer your questions better?

You should definitely change out the accumulator and condenser. I wouldn't trust a 30 year old desiccant bag to still be good. The condenser is probably an old tube and fin design and would have better heat dissipation with a parallel flow type.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.

(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Jun 23, 2016, 5:31 PM)


BNBSTANG
Novice

Jun 24, 2016, 8:05 AM

Post #4 of 14 (468 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

The accumulator is only 15 bucks, and a couple for the orifice. The fan I'm running right now is a reverse rotation flex fan, I plan on swapping to a dual electric if I can find one at the bone yard that'll fit my radiator. The rad is new as is practically everything else. I got the motor done and in, then figured out the heater core no good. but it wasn't bad to replace. I have the service manual for this truck so I'll just go by that for how much oil and refrigerant to add to the system.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jun 24, 2016, 8:29 AM

Post #5 of 14 (466 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Quote you">>I have the service manual for this truck so I'll just go by that for how much oil and refrigerant to add to the system<<"


NO! You have nothing to do with OE specs anymore. You need to do some serious educated guesswork to know oil and refrigerant charge.


This may now take as little at 32oz refrigerant (134a) and ~ 8 oz of PAG 46 most Fords would use not sure that matter just PAG.


If you didn't change the OE condenser you would add about 10 oz. of refrigerant +/-. It's an art to charge an unknown system. Start at 65% of your guess - quick check results and work up slowly. Try like all get out not to go over the magic amount if thought there right it down under the hood,


T
(edit) This is good info for charging and what to expect: http://autoforums.carjunky.com/..._A/C_SYSTEMS_P45460/


PS: Think hard if your "flex" fan is really a great one it's better than electric. If you leave both, think hard, one can fight with the other. By "flex" I mean the real aggressive no fan clutch fans where blades straighten out with plain higher RPM so not so annoying. Had several - fastest and best A/C of any vehicle ever OE to those. Quit making those OE as blades were falling off but never say that........



(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Jun 24, 2016, 8:42 AM)


Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Discretesignals profile image

Jun 24, 2016, 10:15 AM

Post #6 of 14 (458 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Who ever makes flex fans needs to stop selling them. Those are death fans. I know several people who were seriously injured by them when a fan blade came flying out. You bend metal enough times and it breaks. They also sharp as hell, so you have to be careful working around them. Electrical fans would be a nice upgrade. Still think you should upgrade the condenser because you'll have higher pressures going on with the R134a. Higher pressures mean more heat and you need as much condenser surface area as possible. Your compressor will thank you for that.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.

(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Jun 24, 2016, 10:22 AM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jun 24, 2016, 11:18 AM

Post #7 of 14 (452 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Never saw on bust DS - just enough OE ones (a fiber material not metal) would or could fly a blade off, strike a person who might be revving engine for a reason or other's went right thru hoods!.


Was so long ago I would have thought an improved material could be used and end that. My trouble with push and pull fans is some the air flow is messed up by one such that it cancels the other.


Whatever, 83 was a square Billboard of a grille so air really shouldn't be a problem?


T



BNBSTANG
Novice

Jun 24, 2016, 11:45 AM

Post #8 of 14 (446 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Uhm yea, I cut through the top of my thumb and sliced right through the tendon. That's was a month and a half in a cast I didn't need. The stupid thing is I knew better because my friend did the same thing. The issue I have is the 96 and newer GM serpentine setup, spins backwards. I had the stock fan and clutch on there but it was sitting about 3 inches outside the shroud. I obviously have other things going on causing my temp issues that I'm dealing with. Once that's done I will most likely put the stock back on just to see. I don't like the noise the flex fans cause. If I find a big enough electric setup before then I'll go that way. As far as the A/C goes Maybe I should just replace the parts and lines and take it to someone who knows better. Should I just replace the condenser since its the original? If I'm going to do this I want it right!


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jun 24, 2016, 1:27 PM

Post #9 of 14 (441 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

A general rule of thumb for R134 retrofits is 80% of the original capacity although that could change if you put a larger condenser.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



BNBSTANG
Novice

Jun 24, 2016, 3:21 PM

Post #10 of 14 (435 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Does anybody know if any of the auto parts stores loan out the fitting compressors for the A/C lines? I was thinking about just get the line kit from Vintage air, but it has the compression fitting for it. We have one shop in town that I know of and the bend people over getting lines made. The lines I have are ancient and don't line up anymore. Unless there's an easier way I don't know about???


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Jun 24, 2016, 3:37 PM

Post #11 of 14 (432 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

It's not as good looking but you can have rubber hoses made up inexpensively.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



BNBSTANG
Novice

Jun 24, 2016, 3:59 PM

Post #12 of 14 (428 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

They have some kits available on Summit, but not sure what I really need. I'm gonna so some checking. If I replace the accumulator, should I go with the original? That way the high pressure cutoff still has a place to plug in?


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jun 24, 2016, 4:02 PM

Post #13 of 14 (425 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

The only difference accumulators have is the shape, piping and connection type. Chose one that will fit into you connections correctly.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



BNBSTANG
Novice

Jun 24, 2016, 5:26 PM

Post #14 of 14 (419 views)
Re: A/C system for engine swap Sign In

Awesome, thanks. You guys have really helped me out here. As I move on I'll keep you posted.






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