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Who Killed The Electric car?


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carjunky
Enthusiast

Jul 10, 2006, 10:56 AM

Post #1 of 17 (5958 views)
  post locked   Who Killed The Electric car?  

surprising website, that looks into some facts about attacks on California energy standards from big oil and the bush administration and why "Gm" stopped making an electric car, after the bought the Hummer car company, Which gets a great mpg if you are lucky....
http://www.sonyclassics.com/...illedtheelectriccar/


In "GM's" Defense they have a blog posting. That combats a post in the new york times about how they are working hard to push E85... which I agree is a good power source, but its not electric....and the site mentions that they have the most vehicles which get the epa's rating of 30 mpg's.... (which is always less on the real road)

So why did GM stop making an electric car? is it because we could simple set our homes up to run solar power and cut out the middlemen altogether, and there isn't any money in that.

:Gm's blog.
http://www.gm.com/...m/fastlane_Blog.html

(This post was edited by carjunky on Jul 10, 2006, 11:06 AM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Jul 10, 2006, 7:11 PM

Post #2 of 17 (5950 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Just some thoughts on this:

Battery technololgy is still inadequate. How would anyone deice a car or have A/C with just battery power? Either would kill the batteries in no time. There's an infrastructure in place world wide for oil fuels and near none for electric.

These are just a couple problems that must be overcome for an electric only car to be marketable. For now I think the first step will be the hybrids. I hate to see anyone stop trying though. Heck----Look how resistant the world was to make the switch from horses to cars not all that long ago is the history of the world, T



carjunky
Enthusiast

Jul 11, 2006, 7:00 AM

Post #3 of 17 (5947 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Tom I agree.... a Little, yes batteries are still inadequate. But so is oil....

If you look at capitalism, you will see that where the demand is the money goes...... Don't you think that battery companies would poor billions on new battery technology, if they knew that cars would be going electric..... its all about making money....

As with the link posted above... In the video a woman mentions that here "Ev" Electric Vehicle is costing her about $.60 to drive the same amount of mileage that a gallon of gas would cost her. Thats $2.40 cents difference here in NJ alone and we are one of the cheaps states for gas (since we pay for everything else). Besides, I understand battery technology isn't going to get us to take a Florida trip in a car, but it would be great for the commuters that drive 30-100 miles a day and simply just have to plug in your car.... Then have a gas / electric hybrid car for longer trips....

Companies could even offer their employees Plug-in stations for recharging purposes and the Government should offer incentives for companies to do so....

So yes battery tech is still inadequate, but it has come a long way.... my old Sony camera would go through 3 pairs of rechargeable batteries to take about 400 pictures at the NYC Auto Show.... This year my New Nikon Camera D50 model, Took 400 pictures (at 6.2 mega-pixal level) and still could have gone another 500 or 600 pictures, so batteries are getting better. One thing I like to look at is NASA....

Everything that people say isn't good for "We the People".... NASA uses....
  1. Solar panels don't generate enough energy.... NASA uses them On the Space Station....
  2. Fuel Cells aren't Right yet.... NASA Used Them for DECADES....
  3. Hydrogen is Really Dangerous.... NASA Used it for DECADES.....
  4. Hi-TECH Batteries....

This list goes on and on....
Funny Thing about NASA is when they launch a Rocket or Space shuttle, you could get a few gallons of water from all that exhaust.

Its just said that Henry Ford, Had an Eletric car 100 Years ago..... but for some reason they dissappeared too.

But hey we still have 40 years of oil left so we better get every pennies worth out of this earth right... ;-)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Jul 11, 2006, 1:21 PM

Post #4 of 17 (5945 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Careful -- this is strecthing my memory............... NASA contracted GM to make the lunar vehicle for the first "Man on Moon" trip in 1969 and the DAMN thing only worked in 2WD NOT the 4WD with wire wheels as it was supposed to and some un Godly amount on money to make it!!

We are in trouble and better wake up to these things ....... Now .......... not when the last drop of oil is gone!!!!

Someone out there has a really neat sign off that says "You can fix broken -- You can't fix Stupid!" Oh so true!! Do your best for the day, T



Arctic Fox
Novice

Jul 11, 2006, 11:36 PM

Post #5 of 17 (5941 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Now I know we are all hoping for a 100% renewable future... but at the moment, is anyone investing in the oil companies before the oil is gone?


carjunky
Enthusiast

Jul 11, 2006, 11:52 PM

Post #6 of 17 (5938 views)
  post locked   post icon Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Not I... Even though the dividends are good, I don't invest in the big oil. I may consider bp in the future due to their solar power unit, but will need to see. There are other good investments out there and arctic fox I noticed your site mentioned a few renewable stocks, I may take a look at. I also like Ballard fuel cell systems.

I'm actually looking into putting together an electric car , but seeing what a conversion kit would go for.

On another note, isn't it sad how GE and other renewable energy providers do most of their business to oversea's countries. GE is a big supplier of the mega watt wind turbine's and solar panels are getting a little expensive here since a lot of European countries are picking them up.

Funny thing is we made the mistake and still are making them today, yet everyone else is learning by our mistakes and we still do them over and over. We as a country are slaves to oil even the foreign countries that sell oil to us, are planning on lowering the cost, why? So we the people don't seek renewable energy and washington can say that they have the prices under control and delay any production of future vehicles.....

Honda and Toyota have these cars in their labs ready to roll them out.... We actually have some pictures in the carpictures.carjunky.com section, under NYC auto show, 2003.

I get tired of hearing about how dangous all these renewable sources are, when the true danger is depending on a fuel source that you are vey limited to, and must depend on from a foreign country.... That to me sounds like a national security issue...

what happens when these other countries decide then need to keep a reserve for themselves? Do I hear $5. $10 a gallon Plus.... Go to an island or a foreign country they pay, $4-$5 a liter (4 liters in a gallon) its coming slowly but it is coming.... start the push put our farmers back to work.


(This post was edited by carjunky on Jul 12, 2006, 12:11 AM)


carjunky
Enthusiast

Jul 12, 2006, 12:34 AM

Post #7 of 17 (5935 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Just Found this site.

From Ex: BayWatch Star Alexandra Paul whom since 1990 has been driving EV vehicles and was actually arrested when GM started to take and destroy 8,000 EV1 Vehicles which they claimed no-one wanted Alexandra claims she knew at least 5,000 people that wanted to buy the car outright and gm refused...(saidly it was probably one of GMs best made cars) wounder who bullied GM into destroying them in 2002??? Thats the same time the Bush administration started fighting with California about energy regulations....

Also When I say 8000 cars destroyed I really mean crushed... GM didn't renew any leases and took the cars to be destroyed. now why would you want to crush a perfectly good car that people loved driving and wanted to buy? Why not leave them in a warehouse? Where these cars dangerous to us? Or to Big Oil maybe?

http://www.alexandrapaul.com/...sm_electric_cars.htm



Tom to answer the Battery question download this pdf. and look at page 26....
http://www.sonyclassics.com/...triccar/presskit.pdf


(This post was edited by carjunky on Jul 12, 2006, 12:36 AM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Jul 12, 2006, 4:34 PM

Post #8 of 17 (5930 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Does anyone remember Ross Perot? Gee ---- it's funny how he became a BILLIONAIRE to leave GM and shut up! Money talks and bullsh*t walks and that may be the demise of all of us, T



carjunky
Enthusiast

Jul 12, 2006, 9:03 PM

Post #9 of 17 (5929 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

I remember ross didn't he do something with a software company as well?


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Jul 13, 2006, 3:16 AM

Post #10 of 17 (5927 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

I don't know of any wrongdoing by Ross Perot---- I just think he knew too much about some stuff we will never know about. Think about it for a second -- what looks like a fish, feels like a fish, smells like a fish etc. probably is!!

Hey, remember the big three car companies squishing Tucker as the guy scared them with new ideas that could have changed cars as we know them. Hmmm - smell that fish? Wink T



NiraliSherni
User

Apr 14, 2008, 9:55 AM

Post #11 of 17 (5503 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

This site www.ev1.org is asking this same question. They refer to the California Air Resources Board's latest decisions as being responsible for killing the electric car once again.

The weakness of the CARB or the power of the oil companies or both have whittled away the requirement for auto companies to make 10% zero emission vehicles by 2003.

So i think that although the technology of EVs can do with improvements, there are a lot of people willing and eager to switch to EVs, but there seem to be just too many factors conspiring against them right now.


NiraliSherni
User

Apr 21, 2008, 11:25 PM

Post #12 of 17 (5486 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Here (http://www.amectran.com/amectran.htm) is the story of one more electric car that met it's demise in rather sinister circumstances. Seems to be a historical cabal against the EV, that it is repeatedly killed. However, there are people who want to see it resurrected and God willing it will be.

"Edmond X. Ramirez, Sr. inventor of the EXAR-1 Electric Automobile, the "Worlds First (Real) Production, Electronic Powered Automobile" was victimized by the vast surreptitious, illegal and calumnius efforts utilized in preventing the production of the EXAR-1. The following historical documents provide a synopses of how he and this exceptional automobile were destroyed. Years of constantly being dragged into court on trumpted-up charges, struggeling to survive the surreptitious onslaught of nameless, faceless advisories, Ramirez was labeled a "con man"...common sense dictates however, that no con man has ever had a product that actually worked...swindlers sell machines that turn lead into gold...not an advanced, proven and government tested electric automobile that performs as purported by its inventor - an electric automobile that would reduce the nation's dependance on foreign oil while helping save the environment - an electric automobile which provided great concern to the automobile industry over innovations it intended to introduce...unlike Tucker, who only threatened the automobile industry, the EXAR-1 was not too welcome by oil interests either. Over twenty years of furtive, inimical, strategems were used against the EXAR-1 project, finally ending in a cumulative mass of calumny that destroyed Amectran Corporation. At no time could any government agency find fault with the EXAR-1 Electric Automobile...not after years of trying...the only alternative - attack the intrepid inventor by the only effective, proven method - belied brinksmanship."



carjunky
Enthusiast

Aug 29, 2008, 8:11 AM

Post #13 of 17 (5301 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Its pretty simple....

Look at what an electric car will kill...
Oil profits.
Aftermarket parts...
and the list goes on and on...

Just take apart a car... what components are part of the exhaust system they will no longer be needed in an EV. Talking in Billions if not Trillions of Dollars...

Today, electric motors power Cruise ships and Trains... its only time before someone develops some form of small engine generator system that is used to charge the batteries on your car. And then your car's range extends drastically.

I would like to see a company like BP stop the BS and truely flip.... to be beyond petro.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Jun 10, 2009, 5:44 AM

Post #14 of 17 (4510 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Looks like it's going to arrive soon. The "Volt" will be introduced shortly.



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nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
nickwarner profile image

Feb 18, 2010, 12:10 AM

Post #15 of 17 (4260 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

does anyone recall the ad campaign Toyota had in the 90s about a car emphasizing that it doesn't get plugged in? Its because as a people most of us are too damn lazy to hook up an extension cord! The Prius available overseas has an optional battery bank addition and button on the dash that allows it to run 20-30 miles without EVER starting the engine. But you have to plug it in. Most soccer moms and office people living in suburbia feel they are too good to do so. That why electric doesn't work. Along with that, it would still only work in warm places that never get cold. You have to have heat in the car when its snowing out. Not everyone lives in Arizona, Florida or southern California.


Karolina
New User

Mar 18, 2010, 7:31 PM

Post #16 of 17 (4235 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

  

In "GM's" Defense they have a blog posting. That combats a post in the new york times about how they are working hard to push E85... which I agree is a good power source, but its not electric....and the site mentions that they have the most vehicles which get the epa's rating of 30 mpg's.... (which is always less on the real road)

links deleted..................not allowed



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Mar 18, 2010, 7:35 PM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Mar 19, 2010, 5:28 AM

Post #17 of 17 (4222 views)
  post locked   Re: Who Killed The Electric car?  

Note on E85: IMO it will fail in time and be unavailable in my opinion because there's good proof it uses more fossil fuel to produce than the yield of the ethanol AND is subsidized $dollar/gallon now to push it with money the US doesn't have. That and the land now not used for food production just drives up costs for foods that could have been grown on that land.

Flex fueled cars/trucks will still run on regular gasoline and get better MPGs with it!

T







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