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Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles


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planestrainsandcars
Novice

Oct 3, 2020, 9:52 AM

Post #1 of 12 (305 views)
  post locked   Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

2018 Kia Forte, 2.0 L 4 cylinder engine with only 8500 miles. Bought used from the dealership. Dealer said "original owner wanted something bigger" and traded up, that's why the car only had 6500 miles when I bought it.

Great during test drive (at least as far as I could see).

Three months later, transmission is slipping. Going up to high RPM sometimes and then finally shifting. I know it's abnormal because I used to drive a 2017 Kia forte (for three years I drove it) until a deer totalled it recently. In this 2018, shifts are noticeable, not smooth. It seems to shift at odd times, and it vibrates when I'm idling, with my foot on the brake while I'm stopped in a drive thru, for example. Shaking like it's a Sh!tty old car. It's not that old!

Took to dealership, they said there was no problem. But they can't see when the problem comes up. They wouldn't touch the car.

So I took it in my own garage. Checked transmission fluid level according to Kia service manual. Transmission fluid was slightly overfilled. But fluid is clean and smells pretty good. A nice clear red. Outside transmission case looks new, which is good, I suppose. I was worried maybe an older transmission had been put in it (you never know with used cars).

But why the rough, late, slipping, and odd shifting all of a sudden in such a young car with perfect fluid?
Again, I know it's abnormal because I drove a 2017 for three years, they are the same (Generation 2) car (2014-2018). Both made in the mexico factory (checked both VINS). Only difference is this 2018 is technically used. But what could have happened to this car between 0 and 6500 miles? A crash? I bought this car because the body is spotless. Perfect paint. But also the AC compressor clunks when parked and idling. I also had long delayed cranking from cold start, until I put in new spark plugs and gapped them properly. Now the transmission is funny more and more. All these problems.

Is it likely my transmission is going to die?

For a car with 6500 miles, it sure has had all kinds of funny problems. And again, I know what's abnormal here, I drove the same car before for years, this car was really a direct replacement!

With clean transmission fluid at the right level, you would think nothing is being damaged. Maybe it's an odd late bloomer and needs time to break in? Or maybe it is bad, bad solenoid? Maybe the TCM needs recalibrated/reprogrammed? Bad clutch? These are the suggestions of the service manual... The fluid seems fine so it unfortunately seems like it has to be something else.


(This post was edited by planestrainsandcars on Oct 3, 2020, 10:06 AM)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Oct 3, 2020, 10:11 AM

Post #2 of 12 (283 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

We have a single transmission expert on this site (gsferraro) that is pretty busy running his own shop but he should be by eventually to respond.

I can say that delayed shifting is not always a transmission issue. Lack of engine power can do that. I find it very odd that spark plugs had an issue at that low mileage.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



planestrainsandcars
Novice

Oct 3, 2020, 10:29 AM

Post #3 of 12 (279 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

Thanks so much for the reply. Any help is genuinely appreciated, I appreciate you guys for having me here.

Yes, in addition the following is notable to mention. A problem I was having about a month ago was that every, say, 1 in 6 times that I would start my car, it would have oddly long cranking before the engine would finally start. Not terribly, terribly long, but it was a sound we had never heard before in the same car I had driven 3 years prior, and it was enough to make my wife and I look at each other at the same time and say "that doesn't sound right" when it would happen. Thankfully the engine didn't ever fully fail to start, but that long cranking was there. So, the spark plugs were out of spec in terms of their gaps (three years old despite the low mileage, they've been sitting I guess), so they were all replaced with nice ruthenium spark plugs from rockauto, gapped to the 1.0-1.1mm spec. Then, the problem improved drastically. The new properly-gapped plugs were a huge help. And now I would only get long cranking every say, 1 in 20 times. But it was still there and didn't seem right. I had started my Kia previous forte over a thousand times in all kinds of weather and conditions and year after year it never cranked long at all.

I will say, since I've replaced the ignition coils (been maybe 4 days), I have yet to hear any long cranking. Every time so far, it seems to start right up. Knock on wood.

So the fact that ignition coils didn't do much of anything drastic, and the odd shifting problems were still going pretty strong (which I am only assuming are transmission problems but could have been anything) led me to believe I had bad ignition coils based on the symptoms.

Unfortunately you can't multimeter-test these new four-pin ignition coils on the bench (or at least, that is my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong) so I also just recently replaced all four ignition coils with new quality Delphi coils. Already pre-lubed with dielectric grease, installed properly and torqued to spec. I also checked the spark gaps again to be sure. Still perfect. After changing the four coils, things were definitely not worse, but not too too much better. Things seem about the same truthfully. Maybe the engine is a little zippier? I don't know.

And this led me to believe, as I watch my rpms go wild every once in awhile and hear the car shift late, that this must be a transmission problem. But like I said, the fluid is clean and at the right level, so I'm not sure what to do next.

Thanks again for your help. This kind of stuff drives me crazy. FrownMadCrazy


(This post was edited by planestrainsandcars on Oct 3, 2020, 10:36 AM)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Oct 3, 2020, 10:49 AM

Post #4 of 12 (263 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

All of these parts replacements are way out of the norm. It should never need any of these ignition components at this low mileage and I have real doubts that it did.

Spark plugs and coils do not cause long cranking. That is nearly always a fuel issue like loss of prime of the fuel pump.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



planestrainsandcars
Novice

Oct 3, 2020, 10:56 AM

Post #5 of 12 (259 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

If I can humbly say too, I am just a guy in his late twenties trying to learn car maintenance and also save money, because I don't have a lot of money right now and also I am eager to learn. Without tons of diagnostic tools or knowledge in my little garage, the best I could do was buy read the service manual and start troubleshooting and replacing parts. I hope it's ok that I'm here to learn. I am a newbie to car maintenance in general, but try my best to do things in accordance with the service manual at least and use the proper tools. I definitely appreciate the help too.

I definitely agree that the ignition coils may have not been necessary at all, but as for the spark plugs, there was a hugely drastic improvement in the cranking issue after they were replaced. It didn't totally go away, but almost totally.

But you are saying maybe there is a fuel issue that is really at the root of the problem? I had heard if it's not spark plugs or ignition coils, it may be fuel related. But again I just can't comprehend what part it would be. I'm with you, it's so odd on a car this young. Any fuel-related diagnostics that might be prudent to perform?


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Oct 3, 2020, 11:00 AM

Post #6 of 12 (253 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

Isn't this car still under warranty?

Why are you touching it at all?

I didn't intend to get involved in this at all because it was a transmission issue. I'm done for now.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



planestrainsandcars
Novice

Oct 3, 2020, 11:02 AM

Post #7 of 12 (249 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

The dealership refuses to acknowledge any problems on the car and have assured me it's all normal. I apologize, I didn't mean to take your time.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Oct 3, 2020, 11:05 AM

Post #8 of 12 (245 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

Well, now they'll really refuse when they find out you were messing with it. That voids your warranty.

Of course they won't take any action if they can't duplicate the problem.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



planestrainsandcars
Novice

Oct 3, 2020, 11:25 AM

Post #9 of 12 (239 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

Why the animosity?

I didn't mean to intrude on this forum. I apologize if I've disrespected you or anyone else, that was not my intention.

If I've posted in the wrong section or have said something wrong, I'm sorry for that. I understand if you are too busy to help or if more car issues are just stressing you out.

My first response was to try the dealership twice. They said nothing is wrong with it and won't help. So therefore, I realized quite early on I had no warranty. The warranty was full BS as I understood it.

There wasn't going to be a day where we could duplicate the problem. It was going to get worse and worse until the problem is bad enough that the car needs serious repairs.

I don't know if checking the fluid level in accordance with the offical service manual is "messing around", but a man has a right to fix his car in his garage with his own tools. Not everyone needs a full lift and shop just to change brakes or any other work.

I'll seek knowledge somewhere else if I'm not wanted here. If it's a tight-knit community I'm sorry for intruding. No harm intended. Appreciate the help anyway.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Oct 4, 2020, 3:16 AM

Post #10 of 12 (174 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

Sport - no animosity, just facts as we know them. If you do something or take it apart in any way other than routine checking it would be a warranty issue - not personal, the truth.


It has been given back to you as "nothing found" is or isn't a BS job by them not wanting to do something at low pay (warranty work cuts back on the sale profits) so read more and find that in there. Anything to get out of fixing it.


There just might not be anything to do? I can't say from here if it refuses to demonstrate an issue with no other info IDK what anyone could or would do?


I'd go back and insist on it being fixed if you can show there's something out of order about it vs any expected behavior of the car.
Just plain other about low mile finds of the sort: Read driver's door jam build sticker for date it was manufactured. That is it's age could be a year older than model year? From the vin you could run checks on who, what and where info, what services and when. Not so likely but can you find where it was when floods were wrecking new cars by the 1,000s by any look ups just the wrong place if found? Stuff like that.


Keep records of your own or what you find it's new enough there's seller responsibility unless YOU blow it - really.


Think about it: If you sold something and it was messed with, something attempted, taken apart or anything how would you feel when just maybe it was that, that caused an issue?


Right now I don't think this belongs in transmission section it remains unknown to me just what the issue is I dare say dealer not so interested in warranty work the most of the problem you need to get assertive with them,


Tom



planestrainsandcars
Novice

Oct 4, 2020, 6:18 PM

Post #11 of 12 (149 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

I appreciate the honesty, Tom.

I know it's not the tech's fault in this case, but Kia motors has already been caught by the big lawyers and NHTSA that they have been indicating to techs not to fulfill warranty claims (even when the vehicle is demonstrably defective) and instead to convince the consumer it is their fault for not changing the oil, etc, even when oil was changed perfectly. http://www.hyundaiproblems.com/...gine's%20start%2Dup.

This is not the fault of the vehicle owner or dealership tech, but really the automaker.

Now in my case, don't get me wrong. When it's me in my garage I fully admit it's amateur hour. It's full-on romper room time. I actually get in my underwear and put on clown makeup just to switch out brake pads.

No but in all seriousness, I understand my status as a non-ASE certified, non-industry mechanic. I still think I'm capable of changing brake pads, rotors, etc and staying savvy to what's going on in the industry. Once I finish my degree I will pay full-price for the service that mechanics provide. Most people don't put aside money for car work and then blame the mechanic when something goes wrong.

I on the otherhand understand that the mechanic is getting paid to fix the machine that has broken, he needs time to do so, and you get what you pay for. It is expensive, but if you plan for it, the mechanic will treat you (and your car) well if you respect them and pay them properly for the job. It's hard work and I do genuinely have respect for you getting under my car with care.

If the automaker had their way, neither of us would be allowed to touch the car though, it would be dealership only.

Truth betold though Tom, how do you know that the car that rolls into your shop wasn't messed up by the last shop? Or the dealership? Are doctors and surgeons and lawyers perfect? Are mechanics perfect? Doctors do make a bigger paycheck, but you can bet their career is over and their practice must close when a mistake is made on a human body.

If a mistake is made on a car, it can be fixed, or passed off as "not our fault, not our problem".

So how do I feel? I feel pretty Sh!tty when I know that I got my car back, something is messed up, and I know it could have been the dealership, could have been one of the mechanics I went to (or their apprentice), and I'll never know. No one will admit it because it would mean their job. At least doctors are held accountable. Hence the higher pay. This is also a hard truth. Risk vs. Reward.

In the end though, with my car, I did enough searching and landed on checking the throttle body. No idea why, but it was super dirty. Cleaned it up thoroughly with q-tips, shop rags, and throttle-body cleaner. I replaced the fuel filter just for safe measure.

Lo-and behold, the rough idle is gone and the shifting is smoother!

I know you guys hate us young kids, the millenials and the zoomers, but we're not going anywhere. You can be rude all day (and no, we don't appreciate it, I was polite to you guys initially), but it's just one less stop I will ever make at your shop, and one more YouTube video we will make on how to fix it ourselves. Some millenials are lazy. They'll genuinely cry and jack off and play video games, go ask their parents to fix their car, I kid you not. Or they are "above" turning a wrench or physical labor. I know ones who won't even change a lightbulb or cut their grass. Well, I refuse to be that because it's the antithesis of being self-reliant.

Tom was real genuine, polite, and informative with me. Didn't have to be at all. But I would head to Tom's shop 10 times before I ever head to someone's that talked to me like I'm a piece of Sh!t. You guys don't have to be on here providing free advice, I get that. You could be watching TV, working on a project car or getting paid for actual good work. You don't have to help some kid who's messing around with his little car. I am not entitled to your free advice. I just want you to know that I understand that, for what it's worth.

We all have a bottom line every day. Mine is that I need a car that runs so I can get to medical appointments, etc. I am on IVIG right now for an autoimmune disease, insurance does not cover all of it, it's $1000 per treatment out of pocket. Cannot afford a mechanic right now. Not your problem, but doesn't change the fact that the money to pay you for work does not exist right now. So I won't ask for it. I would never, ever expect you to do the work you do for free. In one word: it's backbreaking. It's worth the $1000 to drop your vehicle off, and pick it up with a new part already in place, tuned and tested, ready to go.

But despite just not having the money for that, I'm not going to lay down and die or go be a homeless bum. I need wheels to get me to work, store, and doctor and I will do what I can within my rights as a citizen to work in my garage. And I think if the service manual is followed and you are technically inclined (I and my family are all engineers), a layman is possible of changing brakes, fluids, and other parts. This is another hard truth.

A layman can't do surgery or navigate theoretical legal concepts in front of a judge, but he can change spark plugs and even suspension parts if he has the service manual.

Sorry to be abrasive back. Probably won't be welcome back, but my problems are solved for now anyway. Wish you all the best.

The ASE test is affordable enough though, so if that's the way I need to learn to fix my own car and save money, the books can be pirated online for free, I will hit the books and start learning in my free time.

Help or not, I am going to continue to support my personal bottom line, and I wish you fellas the best with yours, because I know being a mechanic can be tough. The customers are ruthless, the cars are never maintained, and the manufacturers keep making things harder. I am not tough enough to handle that life day to day, so respect to the men who can.


(This post was edited by planestrainsandcars on Oct 4, 2020, 6:20 PM)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Oct 4, 2020, 6:29 PM

Post #12 of 12 (143 views)
  post locked   Re: Transmission slipping on Kia Forte 2018 with only 8500 miles  

WOW..................

All I did is tell you that you have a manufacturers warranty and by working on the car yourself you are voiding that warranty. You felt the need to go into a full chapter of rant about it.

I'm glad you got your car fixed but in the future try a therapist instead of a mechanic.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.







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