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overheating with heater on
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 4:56 AM
Post #1 of 24
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overheating with heater on
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I have a 2002 Chevrolet cavalier that all of a sudden started over heating with the heater going. heated up to over 200+ degrees last line before fed. shut heater off and temp went down. engine is a 2.2 has 155k miles please help. have had evap problem for some time and replaced all evap parts. now the heating problem starts
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Discretesignals
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Feb 25, 2015, 5:56 AM
Post #2 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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Doesn't really make sense for the vehicle to overheat when you turn the heater on and then cool off when the heater is switched off. Was the ac compressor running when it decided to start running hot? AC compressor will run on some models when you have the mode selected for defrost Does this overheat while your idling or cruising when you turn the heater on? How is the coolant condition and level. Might need to get hold of a scan tool, that you can watch the ECT value on, and see if it jives with the gauge.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Feb 25, 2015, 5:56 AM)
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 8:56 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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no sir the ac compressor wasn't running and the car heated up then shut heater off temp went back to normal range. was told could be heater core plugged. but I don't know fluid levels are at correct level and doesn't seem to change when checked heats up both idle and moving
(This post was edited by magicman201080 on Feb 25, 2015, 9:00 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 25, 2015, 9:26 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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? This all began with replacing an A/C evaporator? Almost all are quite involved and most or many vehicles need or allow flow thru heater core and adjust or block temp with diverter/blend doors. Are or did you get heat when asked for or nothing?
The common denominator is the evaporator job then this so somehow something probably went wrong with that job. Both heather hoses should feel warm/hot in hand with any credible engine temp and if one is stone cold something is wrong. Yes a plugged core that is used (if so) as a bypass flow of coolant for engine will matter but all the time not making sense with just request for heat and showing hot.
OK - My question is do you get heat when asking for heat only on floor vent outlets? If not ever we check on why not,
T
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 10:24 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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car was warm and melted ice on windshield the evap was the canister and surge soloed not the ac. car was running fine now today it overheated and when I shut off heater the temp went right back down to the normal temp around 195
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Hammer Time
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Feb 25, 2015, 10:48 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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Shutting off the heater has nothing to do with your overheating. I'm suspecting you still have air pockets in the system that need to be burped out.
Don't forget, this engine is designed to run at over 225 at idle so that shouldn't be an issue.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Feb 25, 2015, 10:49 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 25, 2015, 10:49 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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Let the confusion rule. When you mention an engine heating issue and recent "evap" I think normally techs would take that as A/C not evaporative emissions parts!
So let's start over: Still you say this began exactly when those parts were replaced? I'd just look and see if anything is obviously out of place, check coolant level now and you need to know that it's full in the radiator and engine air free despite this "evap" work shouldn't really have involved draining engine coolant but a wild maybe some wire got involved?
As DS said right away it's not consistent with use of heater and overheating, in fact if you were running too warm even on a hot day requesting heat should HELP cool engine not the other way - that leaves coolant level, plugged core if used as a by-pass for cooling system. I'd have to plain look.
Still - asked you if heater worked on floor vents not if it melted ice on windshield suggests you were using defroster/defog/or a section for both heat and mix with floor vents which does engage compressor if it is even close to warm enough under the hood it will engage compressor.
We need that OUT of the problem if there's a problem at all. Many of these cars do not hold a steady #/spot on the dash gauge and perhaps you are just now noticing?
Various ways when compressor is in a request mode fans come on in many needed or not for A/C and some know it's cold and don't and I'll never know which ones do what all off the top of my head.
Back to topic: If I had to guess you are low on coolant in radiator/engine which will cause bizarre behavior. If it wasn't touched then you need to know why if found low at all,
T
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 11:00 AM
Post #8 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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had a service person look at the antifreeze and the level said both level and condition was fine. am going to try driving home later with out the heater on in any mode and see what happens will also stop and have a repairman look at it and see if they say what it is. have little to no money on fixed income and cant really afford this but ...........
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 11:24 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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im sorry I sound stupid but when it comes to cars I am. im not a mechanic and have to ask the professionals for help. I try everything I am told to try and still have no clue. if I am looked at as a problem please let me know I will try another site. thanks for all the help. I really do appreciate it.
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 25, 2015, 11:30 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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I asked for level in the radiator not easy to know if this doesn't have a radiator cap so that info is useless.
When it shows warm to near hot does fan for radiator come on under hood? That you can check. If cool weather some may not need to come on much or at all even sitting still,
T
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 11:40 AM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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yes as it heats up the cooling fan kicks on and runs for awhile and then shuts off. was told that is normal operating for that. has no cap just plastic container on passenger side of engine compartment
(This post was edited by magicman201080 on Feb 25, 2015, 11:41 AM)
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 1:09 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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was just told that it sounds like a water pump gone bad. don't see any leaks coming from it and antifreeze levels are fine
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 1:11 PM
Post #13 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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how would I have gotten air into the system? nothing had been repaired that had to do with the cooling system
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Hammer Time
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Feb 25, 2015, 1:13 PM
Post #14 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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If the fan is coming on and then shutting off, the car IS NOT overheating.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 25, 2015, 1:29 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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OK - That type the tank you see thru is also where the pressure cap is where you would ad BUT if there's a problem or system was drained for any reason you can't just fill the system from that!
Vacuum filled if it was drained or other tricks.
OK - You see if even the hose from that tank to the radiator had a leak it might not draw coolant back from tank to radiator and engine as it normally does when cooling down so air would be drawn back but the tank looks like it's fine - lousy way for car makers to do it that way.
Doubt you have any fancy tools so try this. Cold start, feel upper radiator hose for NO pressure by squeezing it. It may even make a sound of sloshing and air? Now as engine warms up that hose shouldn't have much pressure very quickly but see if it does for another possible problem. Let it warm up enough so hose now has some heat (careful) in it and by then some pressure. If none of that there's a problem to fix first before finding out what else might be wrong if anything.
System idea on this: Coolant expands when warmed up and sends the extra to that tank which is also going to allow pressure by the cap's design. As it approaches the pounds of the rating of that cap it lets coolant in and you see the marks for full cold and hot on those tanks.
Now when it cools the cap again when coolant is shrinking is only going to let back liquid coolant not air so system if perfect and designed perfectly would self purge out air and draw back just coolant/liquid but either anything wrong or not purged of air when working on it, it may never get all or enough air out and there's your reason for erratic temp gauge and heater use.
It stinks but you really may not know if system is full or if touched when the "evap" stuff was worked on and it does take time and some effort for anyone to fill the cooling system up properly - some may get close and think it will self purge out what's left and it never does.
Need to know if you have to take it somewhere and just have it vacuum filled. If so and problem is all gone that was it. Air/vapor will mess up sensors accuracy, real hot spots and perhaps sudden cold readings and so on. Gotta know it's full...........
T
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Hammer Time
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Feb 25, 2015, 1:47 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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Why are we messing around with anything? If the fan is cycling, the temperate is under control. You're just trying to fix something that isn't broken.
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 1:52 PM
Post #17 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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hammertime you haveno idea how to fix anything and you are rude and think you know it all you don't need to respond to me anymore ill deal with the professionals that are on here
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nickwarner
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Feb 25, 2015, 2:18 PM
Post #18 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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As an ASE certified master tech, HT actually does know how to fix something. You have already stated you do not.
He has tried to explain to you that you do not have anything physically broken on your car that will damage your engine and cause you to need to spend the money you have stated you do not have to spend.
Your cooling fan is set to come on at a certain temp to draw the engine temp down, and once it has done that to cycle back off to prevent the engine from running cold. There is a sweet spot it needs to run at tempwise. If your car was overheating, the fan would be staying on as the ECM would realize it had not yet succeeded in dropping your engine temp enough. The fan coming off proves it has done this.
Your heater core isn't plugged if you are feeling good heat coming out of your vents. A plugged core gives off little to no heat. It also cannot make your engine overheat. It is essentially a mini radiator placed there for your comfort, not for engine cooling.
Your gauge and your computer use two different sensors to read coolant temp. It is possible you have a bad one for the gauge or some other issue giving you these readings, and remember as HT pointed out this car was designed to run 225 degrees at idle.
But I really think getting lippy with a moderator is a bad idea whatever forum you use, especially if you had actually taken the time to read the posts and realize that all of this has already been explained to you and you seem to either just not understand it or just seem to want to believe no matter what that something is wrong with your car.
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Feb 25, 2015, 2:26 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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magicman201080 You keep running your mouth and you will be looking for another forum.
Maybe you think this is my first rodeo and I have no idea what I'm talking about. You would be very wrong about that. YHour car is operating exactly as it was designed to.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Feb 25, 2015, 2:27 PM)
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Hammer Time
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Feb 25, 2015, 2:28 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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Maybe you need proof.
Cooling System Description and Operation
Cooling Fan Control
The engine cooling fan system consists of one cooling fan and one relay. The relay is powered by the battery positive voltage circuit and controlled by a switched ground from the powertrain control module (PCM).
During operation, the PCM supplies the ground path for the cooling fan relay through the cooling fan relay control circuit. This energizes the cooling fan relay coil, closes the relay contacts, and supplies battery positive voltage from the cooling fan fuse through the cooling fan motor supply voltage circuit to the cooling fan. The cooling fan motor is grounded through its own ground circuit.
The PCM commands the fan on under the following conditions:
- Engine coolant temperature exceeds approximately 106°C (223°F).
- A/C refrigerant pressure exceeds 1310 kPa (190 psi).
- A/C is requested and vehicle speed is below 100 km/h (62 mph) with A/C pressure above 1413 kPa (205 psi).
- Vehicle speed is less than 8 km/h (5 mph) for more than 750 seconds. The fan will turn off when vehicle speed is greater than 8 km/h (5 mph) for more than 20 seconds.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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magicman201080
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Feb 25, 2015, 2:38 PM
Post #21 of 24
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Re: overheating with heater on
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was told by a repairman that it is the water pump and that it is not pumping water. the bottom hose is cold and the top hose is hot with no water circulating thank you to the professionals on this site you were very helpful as for others well.............................. enough said about them
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Hammer Time
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Feb 25, 2015, 3:05 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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If I were you I'd be looking for a different repairman because he is wrong but you'll never come back here and admit he was wrong and you wasted your money.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Discretesignals
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Feb 25, 2015, 5:11 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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I agree with HT. Something doesn't add up. If the water pump was bad, the engine would overheat fairly quickly. Also as HT stated the cooling fan would be running high speed and would never shut down. A pump that isn't pumping that great may also cause you to have poor heater performance.
Which engine is this? The ECOtech or OHV LN4? Take a pic of the faulty pump when your mechanic gets it out. Post it up in here. Curious to see what it looks like.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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Hammer Time
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Feb 25, 2015, 5:16 PM
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Re: overheating with heater on
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I don't even get what he is chasing here. It appears to be just the fact that the temp gauge goes over 200. That isn't going to change no matter how many pumps he changes.
I bet I don't get an apology when he finally realizes I'm right either.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Feb 25, 2015, 5:18 PM)
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