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Help me settle a bet


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Guest
Anonymous Poster

Nov 28, 2008, 7:33 PM

Post #1 of 4 (1237 views)
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I know that modern engines burn 99% of the fuel they use. Almost 100% complete combustion occurs but I need to find a source that says that and I was hopong you could direct me to one.

I am arguing with a guy who says 60% goes out the tail pipe and I know that is absurd. I just need source that confirms this reality that he will believe. He's a conspiracy guy who thinks big oil controls the laws of thermodynamics.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Nov 28, 2008, 8:15 PM

Post #2 of 4 (1234 views)
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I don't have the published article you seek but know that there's a difference between the % of energy that is fully burned and the % of power you extract from doing so. Somewhat like the incandescent light bulb's % of energy used to make light vs what makes heat - a crime!

My best guess is right about now the internal combustion engine is "extracting" about 50-60% at best of available horse power of "burning" fossile fuel. The rest is in fact wasted to heat, friction. Incomplete burning right now is pretty low as you indicated.

IMO - the most waste that could still be captured with techno advances is the wasted heat out a tailpipe. You don't hear much about that??

Just a wild thought I've always had is what if we could capture the waste heat to create steam from a minimal amount of water for example to turn a turbine mmaking something we could use on demand later - electricity or something other than watching it go right out the pipe!

So, IMO you are both about right depending on just how you look at it. We are getting about 99+% of available energy but not all is for powering a vehicle if that's the example.

I seriously don't think oil company conspiracy is involved at all! They'd just love it if more efficient engines were produced because again IMO the nature of people would be to use it up for bigger and better vehicles of all types with lighter engines getting more bang for the buck - a win, win for all,

T



Guest
Anonymous Poster

Nov 28, 2008, 8:30 PM

Post #3 of 4 (1230 views)
Re: Help me settle a bet Sign In


In Reply To
I don't have the published article you seek but know that there's a difference between the % of energy that is fully burned and the % of power you extract from doing so. Somewhat like the incandescent light bulb's % of energy used to make light vs what makes heat - a crime!

My best guess is right about now the internal combustion engine is "extracting" about 50-60% at best of available horse power of "burning" fossile fuel. The rest is in fact wasted to heat, friction. Incomplete burning right now is pretty low as you indicated.

IMO - the most waste that could still be captured with techno advances is the wasted heat out a tailpipe. You don't hear much about that??

Just a wild thought I've always had is what if we could capture the waste heat to create steam from a minimal amount of water for example to turn a turbine mmaking something we could use on demand later - electricity or something other than watching it go right out the pipe!

So, IMO you are both about right depending on just how you look at it. We are getting about 99+% of available energy but not all is for powering a vehicle if that's the example.

I seriously don't think oil company conspiracy is involved at all! They'd just love it if more efficient engines were produced because again IMO the nature of people would be to use it up for bigger and better vehicles of all types with lighter engines getting more bang for the buck - a win, win for all,

T


I am just trying to find a simple statement that says that combustion is nearly 100%. He is confusing thermal efficiency with combustion efficiency.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Nov 28, 2008, 8:39 PM

Post #4 of 4 (1226 views)
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That's easy! Raw hydrocarbons can be measured out a tailpipe now. Many read near ZERO with some credit to "converters" but really - most all is actually burned up. You want a # - I'll venture the 99%!

T







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