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96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged?


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Neptun3
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Apr 23, 2013, 1:11 PM

Post #1 of 31 (11571 views)
96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Hello everyone, so I was driving the other day and both my alternator and power steering belts popped off. I checked under the hood to see what the problem was and I noticed that the pulley which uses both belts was loose. I tightened it and put the belts back on, started the car and the belts popped off again. So then I unscrewed the pulley to check it out and saw that a small part of the teeth got worn out and therefore wouldn't stay properly on the crankshaft. I also looked under the car and saw that the part where it connects to on the crankshaft was a little worn out as well.

Pic of Pulley:



Pulley up close:



Crankshaft (Where the pulley connects to):



Is there anyway to fix this? Would perhaps getting a new pulley be sufficient to preventing it from getting loose and the belts from popping off again?

Thanks.


(This post was edited by Neptun3 on Apr 23, 2013, 1:46 PM)


Hammer Time
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Apr 23, 2013, 1:54 PM

Post #2 of 31 (11547 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

The key-way is destroyed from running loose. If you're real luck you may be able to replace the key-way and pulley and save it. If you're not so lucky, the crank is damaged and you're looking for an engine.
Maker sure the new key-way fits tight with no wobble. If the slot in the crank is damaged, you are looking at another engine.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



nickwarner
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Apr 23, 2013, 1:55 PM

Post #3 of 31 (11544 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

That part is your harmonic balancer. It dampens vibrations from your running engine. If you run a bad one long enough the crankshaft can physically snap in two. At minimum it will hammer apart your rod and main bearings which would require an overhaul to repair.

Get a new balancer and make sure the crankshaft splines are OK. Cranks are made of a harder steel than the balancer so it should likely be alright. Those splines didn't fail on their own, so closely inspect the crank pulley threads to be sure they are ok along with the bolt. Running it loose will wreck it. Repair any threads you find damaged, get a new bolt of the identical size and grade, and put some blue Loctite on it when you install it. I would also replace the keyway on the crank. Its pretty beat up from getting loose.


Neptun3
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:03 PM

Post #4 of 31 (11485 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Thanks guys for the responses. I really appreciate it. How would I go about removing the keyway on the crank?


Hammer Time
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:09 PM

Post #5 of 31 (11482 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Just tap it out with a screwdriver and small hammer. It's pushed into a groove tightly.



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Discretesignals
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:19 PM

Post #6 of 31 (11479 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

That key is also used by the timing belt crank sprocket.





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Hammer Time
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:21 PM

Post #7 of 31 (11476 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Didn't realize that. that means the timing belt and crank gear have to be removed first.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Discretesignals
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:24 PM

Post #8 of 31 (11474 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Going to have a good ole time getting the sprocket off. It has to slide over the bad part of the key. You'll probably have to file the bad spot off, so you get the sprocket over it.


You should replace the crankshaft pulley bolt too since it has been chucking around. Make sure the bolt is tightened to 183 ft/lbs. Don't run the engine anymore until you fix that. Don't try to rig it with duct tape or JB weld. Fix it right the first time using the right parts.

Your lucky the key didn't shear at the belt sprocket or you would be ripping the head off.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.

(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Apr 24, 2013, 4:32 PM)


nickwarner
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:34 PM

Post #9 of 31 (11468 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

This would be the ideal time to change your timing belt, idlers, tensioner and water pump with a Gates kit. You'll have to take it off anyway and I'd be willing to bet its dues for service. You will need to follow the service info to the letter when you do it, as once you take the timing belt off if you turn that engine at all you WILL bend valves in the head and be facing a very very expensive problem. We can help you work your way through that if you wish, but you will need to follow our instructions to the letter if you want to be able to drive it again later. If you think this job might be over your head, you should have it towed to a competent shop.


Hammer Time
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Apr 24, 2013, 4:48 PM

Post #10 of 31 (11466 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

I wouldn't be surprised if a substandard timing belt job is what started this whole mess. Somebody left that crank pulley loose.



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Discretesignals
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Apr 24, 2013, 5:10 PM

Post #11 of 31 (11462 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

I am very sure of that HT. You know how hard them Honda bolts are too get off. You practically need a 1" impact to get it off. I am sure a lot of DIY don't have the special tool to hold the balancer hub when you go to tighten the bolt. They think it is tight because they can't hold the crank from turning anymore with their hands or water pump pliers...LOL. Trying to put 183 ft/lbs on a bolt without the crank turning while laying on a gravel driveway has to be a mother.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.

(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Apr 24, 2013, 5:11 PM)


Neptun3
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Apr 30, 2013, 3:19 PM

Post #12 of 31 (11407 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Thanks guys for the responses I really appreciate it. A timing belt job seems kinda difficult so I don't think I would be able to do it by myself and I don't have the money to take it to a shop and have it done there.

I tried pulling the woodruff key out with vice grips using all of my strength and it's not coming out. However, when I put the pulley onto the key it seats correctly so is it possible that I'm just not tightening the bolt hard enough? When I tighten it at a certain point and continue tightening, the pulley and bolt move together so I really can't tighten it anymore. Do I need a special tool for tightening it to the correct torque spec (183 ft/lbs)?


(This post was edited by Neptun3 on Apr 30, 2013, 3:25 PM)


Hammer Time
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Apr 30, 2013, 3:23 PM

Post #13 of 31 (11401 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

No, that pulley and keyway were destroyed. Don't even try to put that back together that way. You will be buying an engine for sure.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



nickwarner
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Apr 30, 2013, 4:45 PM

Post #14 of 31 (11396 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

With HT on this, and yes there is a special tool to hold that still while torquing the bolt to spec.


Neptun3
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May 1, 2013, 8:05 PM

Post #15 of 31 (11376 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Hey looks like I was able to get the key out! I wasn't pulling on the right part but now it's out.

Woodruff key:



Crank pulley with no key:



So I guess all I have to do now is get a new key and harmonic balancer. Is there a specific way to lock the new key in or does it just push in and stay secure?


(This post was edited by Neptun3 on May 1, 2013, 9:24 PM)


Hammer Time
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May 2, 2013, 3:29 AM

Post #16 of 31 (11357 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

The key is supposed too remove any sort of wobble or movement in the pulley when it is slid on. If there is any wear in the slot that allows the key to move at all, then you have a serious problem with the crank shaft. If the Crank is still OK, then just make sure the hold down bolt is tightened to proper torque.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Neptun3
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May 2, 2013, 11:05 AM

Post #17 of 31 (11346 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Oh ok, is the key shaped differently on both sides? If so which side goes in first? Also, I can't seem to find the key anywhere online. I tried calling 1A Auto to see if the key came with the harmonic balancer and they said I would have to buy it separately.


Hammer Time
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May 2, 2013, 12:25 PM

Post #18 of 31 (11339 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

No, you're going to have to get that from the dealer. The key will only settle in one way.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Neptun3
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May 2, 2013, 9:36 PM

Post #19 of 31 (11320 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Oh, well I just found out RockAuto sells the key with the harmonic balancer so I'm probably gonna go with that. One more thing, how do I know when it's at the correct torque spec while tightening? Thanks again for the help everyone.


Hammer Time
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May 3, 2013, 3:05 AM

Post #20 of 31 (11309 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

181 foot pounds



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Tom Greenleaf
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May 3, 2013, 3:31 AM

Post #21 of 31 (11301 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Neptun3 : You know it's there with a torque wrench - probably rentable if you don't care to own one,

T



Discretesignals
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May 3, 2013, 5:05 AM

Post #22 of 31 (11293 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

Hope you didn't turn the crank with the key out or valve spring pressure didn't rotate the timing belt drive sprocket.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.


Neptun3
User

May 11, 2013, 10:42 PM

Post #23 of 31 (11232 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

I cannot get this bolt to tighten to 185 ft/lbs torque. At first I tightened it with a ratchet until the pulley began to move with the bolt. Then I used the honda crank pulley holder and a breaker bar to hold the pulley in place and a torque wrench to try to tighten it. I am literally using all of my strength and this thing has not turned at all. Here are some pics of how I have it set up.

Honda crank pulley holder w/ breaker bar and torque wrench:



Close up of crank pulley holder:



Why won't this bolt tighten? I put on a new harmonic balancer and woodruff key by the way.


Neptun3
User

May 14, 2013, 5:03 PM

Post #24 of 31 (11195 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

I think I got it on tight enough. After putting the belts back on I was able to drive the car around! While it was on I checked under the hood and noticed the harmonic balancer looked like it was shaking a little bit as it was rotating. Is it supposed to look like that while the car is running? I'll try to upload a video later when my car battery is done charging.


(This post was edited by Neptun3 on May 14, 2013, 5:06 PM)


Tom Greenleaf
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May 15, 2013, 4:44 AM

Post #25 of 31 (11176 views)
Re: 96 Honda Accord Crankshaft Pulley and Crankshaft Damaged? Sign In

No. It should be as true as true gets. Is it perfectly lined up in 'plane' with belt to other pulleys? Should be.

I take it that it's moving as a wobble not up and down. IDK - can you see center part and bolt move and outer ring moving and those not? IMO there could be a defective balancer, crankshaft + balancer didn't actually mesh together properly from damage or damage to the new balancer along the way in it's installation. Hard to say right now. If crankshaft itself could be real trouble. How long it could last that way if so is a guess at best if running well now,

T







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