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'98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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eliminohpea
Novice
Mar 12, 2009, 7:36 PM
Post #1 of 16
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'98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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The facts: 1998, Olds Cutlass, v6, approx. 115000 miles. Turned it on today to find power steering gone, shortly after the battery light came on. Was able to get it into the garage, but don't have hope for it going much further.
After taking a good hard look with a friend we think the crankshaft no longer turns. The serpentine belt is not broken, just slipped off and I can not turn the crankshaft with my hands.
So my question is just overall help please? As with many people, money is kinda tight right now and I really don't want to call a mechanic out here if I can avoid it. And I REALLY don't want to get a new car. Does this sound like something that I can repair, or will it need a full blown rebuild? My friend said he has heard of some liquid stuff that is supposed to loosen the crank from the engine to help it turn, have you heard of such a thing and does it work?
ANY advice is appreciated. I just can't afford big car trouble right now and I am hoping and hoping that this won't be a thousand dollar repair......
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 12, 2009, 7:53 PM
Post #2 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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If I understand this, the belt is off and you can't turn the crankshaft pulley by hand - right? That would be normal as your hands are not a starter motor. That crank pulley should turn with the engine cranking by the starter and probably does if you look again with someone cranking and you looking.
The belt fell off is the issue as I see it so far. Now need to know why that happened. While it's off spin the other pulleys and check for any wobble or noise just spinning them by hand. Water pump won't coast for you and ps pulley won't either but they shouldn't "rock" back and forth either.
There's a tensioner pulley there with a bearing and sprung to maintain the correct tension constantly and might have been at the limit of range for the old belt and that alone could have allowed it to get tossed off.
I suggest putting a new belt on - forget the one that fell off and watch that the tensioner is in the middleish part of its range with the new belt. Most are retracted with a 3/8th or 1/2 inch square like a flex handle could do - sometimes with a short extension to get in there. There are kits to make retracting the tensioner quick and easy but can be done on most with some common tools you may have,
T
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eliminohpea
Novice
Mar 13, 2009, 7:30 AM
Post #3 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Ok, so good news! The crankshaft appears to be fine, didn't have a friend nearby so it was fun times setting up a camera to see it  . So now I start the task of putting the belt back on. The belt is fairly new, it was just put on in the summer so I don't think it needs to be replaced. My thoughts are that for one reason or another it simply lost tension and slipped off. Speaking of, how will I know when proper tension is reached? I mean, I know it's supposed to be 'tight' but is there a definate way to tell when it's just right?
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 13, 2009, 7:57 AM
Post #4 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Take a good look at the pic. This should be the tensioner pulley on your car but you are looking at the back side right now. Note the square notch AND the square hole. Whether wrench or plain ratchet for the hole with no socket on it this will swing to allow you to put the belt back on. Right now with belt off it is at it's extreme of the range of adjustment meaning if you could put the belt back on or even close right now something ain't right! You can't just push this thing around by hand so easy - on purpose to hold belt at a pre-set tension. It obviously couldn't do that properly OR there is pulley problem with this item or another OR belt is plain too long now for this no matter how new it is.
More: I see you are by yourself but with some basic tools you can do this. Put the old one back if needed to use the car to go get parts - laugh! Look for a belt routing diagram underhood on a decal. If that's missing it should look like this pattern .....
In that the "cs" means crankshaft - others not marked in this pic. Crankshaft won't turn by hand - it goes with the engine as you noted now.
Working along can be a problem so get the belt started on as many pulleys as you can. It helps me to use a bungee cord to hold the loose belt up taught to a hole in opened hood (support hood with something!) till you get to one last easy one, then retract that tensioner and slide the belt over the last easy pulley and let the tensioner do its thing! Voila! Before starting engine make dang sure the belt in on exactly right on each pulley such that peaks and valleys of the grooves all line up. If it lasts 5 seconds when you start the engine you are probably on properly but look anyway for anything wrong.
OK: You should be up and running as it was right before this happened but THERE'S SOMETHING WRONG because this doesn't just fall off so easy like that.
Hit back with any questions if I've just confused the heck out of you,
T
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eliminohpea
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:00 AM
Post #5 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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nono, not confused at all. I was just working on putting the belt back on, harder than it looks, when I did notice that the crankshaft isn't exactly in line with the other gears. As in, it is not vertically in line. The belt has to move out on the horizontal axis just a bit in order to reach it. Not much, maybe 1/2 inch. Do you know, supposed to be like that?
And, Tom, you've been a great help. Thank you so much.
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:08 AM
Post #6 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Wow - that was fast getting back to me! I was just done re-reading my own garbage and your back.
The belt should be in a perfect "plane" if you will. If a pulley or perhaps that crankshaft (largest) is not in line it's NOT right! Somewhat rare but crankshaft pulley is also called a "harmonic balancer" and is the grooved pulley mounted permanantly on the center with rubber isolation that can slip - a big NO NO and shouldn't be off a hair.
More: This 1/2 inch off isn't allowed. That's a lot! It either isn't on the pulleys properly or a pulley ANY of them could have a problem. From a front view this belt should line up and be in a perfect plane if you will.
If one is off try to describe it and I'll try to figure out what item it is,
T
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eliminohpea
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:14 AM
Post #7 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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So, just tried starting her up and the belt slipped off again immediately. The crankshaft is definitely out of alignment  All the other gears and pulleys n' such are fine, just the crankshaft is off.
Suggestions?
(This post was edited by eliminohpea on Mar 13, 2009, 8:19 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:20 AM
Post #8 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Arggh! At least you know it. That is an assembly. I'll look in a second to see if they sell those commonly or not. I would consider a good used one and there's more to replacing that than the others - may need to send it out.
First let me see if I can find one new and how much they are. Taking one off requires a puller which can be rented - let's see if this is a DIY for you or not - let me know what you have for tools,
T
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eliminohpea
Novice
Mar 13, 2009, 8:23 AM
Post #9 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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This makes me so sad.....
I've got all basic tools, my father has everything I could possibly need. He lives a few hundred miles away, but I may be able to talk him into making a road trip.
When you say assembly, does this mean a complete engine rebuild and replace most everything under the hood? Gotta say I really hope that's not the case
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:32 AM
Post #10 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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I plain don't know how easy this one is to get at. There's a large bolt in the center of that thing - feel for it. That can take air tools to remove - then probably four bolts and with those out you use a puller and threaded bolts that reach just so to pull it off. Forgive me - it's been a while and I haven't done one on this engine yet.
Here's some info from AutoZone and they do sell these. I'm not quite sure why the prices are so different and why the also sell a repair kit for it so this type failure is something new to me. I kinda thought if it lost its position it was done with??
~~~~~~~~~
Harmonic Balancer
Dorman / Harmonic Balancer  for a 1998 Oldsmobile Cutlass 
Related Parts  Repair Sleeve-Harmonic Balancer  Belt Timing Cover Gasket About this product: Part Number: 594-148 Weight: 2.5 lbs. Warranty: 1 YR  Pricing: $65.99  Availability: Store: Not Available Online: Ships within 2 business days Shipping Restrictions: - Overnight and two-day shipping are not available for PO Box, APO/FPO/DPO or US Territory addresses
Store:   Online: 
~~~~
If that doesn't show ok just Google AutoZone parts for your car or this pic show above might be its own link to where I was looking for that part,
T
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:35 AM
Post #11 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Forgot to add - sometimes you can get a straight shot at these thru the wheel well with wheel removed and plastic inner fender shield moved some or removed to get access,
T
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eliminohpea
Novice
Mar 13, 2009, 8:36 AM
Post #12 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Thanks so much for your help, I'll have to do a bit more research on the actual process of replacing it. Though I guess I've been lucky since this is really the only big thing that's happened to my car in 6 years.
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 13, 2009, 8:51 AM
Post #13 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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It's absolutely replaceable! Don't let this get to you even if you hire just this part out to replace it shouldn't be that bad. I'm a tad confused by the choices which you can decide as needed. This does NOT mean the engine is shot at all - just some kind of funky luck - most last forever that I know of but I've been retired from this a long time now too.
Good luck with it. BTW - best not to run engine with this off the engine even if it's slid and without the belt you could move the car - no power anything but it should run as it did. If it comes off at all don't run engine - it's stupid but VERY needed for engine balance - hence the name "Harmonic Balancer" .....
T
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eliminohpea
Novice
Mar 13, 2009, 2:32 PM
Post #14 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Well, $330 later, but my car works again! The harmonic balancer was exactly it, and the mechanic was so impressed that I diagnosed the problem myself  !
He actually had 4 cars come in just this week with the same exact problem, so apparently it's pretty common.
Thanks again for your help, couldn't have done it without you! 
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Loren Champlain Sr
Veteran
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Mar 13, 2009, 3:24 PM
Post #15 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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Pardon my nosing in, here.
eliminohpea; You are right; This is a very common problem. We replace quite a few GM harmonic balancers. Some Chrysler products, as well. They don't make 'em like they used to. Don't know if the mechanic showed you the parts? The inner hub attaches to the crankshaft with that large bolt. The outer ring (with the actual pulley) is vulcanized (rubber) to the inner ring, hence two seperate pieces. Over time, especially if you have an oil leak, the rubber deteriorates and the two pieces come apart. Will also cause one heck of a noise and many times a vibration, since the crank depends on that part to balance it.
Loren
SW Washington
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eliminohpea
Novice
Mar 13, 2009, 6:11 PM
Post #16 of 16
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Re: '98 Olds Cutlass Crankshaft
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That was the weird part about mine is that there was no noise or vibrations, no oil leak either. You're right that the two pieces came apart and the rubber was all cracked, but Wednesday night my car was fine and Thursday morning it was all messed up. I'm just relieved that it was only a $300 fix.
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