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ignition switch problem???
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tusseltussel
User
Feb 3, 2010, 10:24 AM
Post #1 of 12
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ignition switch problem???
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1980 ford f350 1 ton 351\m with the motorcraft 2150
hello once again my old truck went south. you all have been very helpfull keepin me on the road and once again i could use some advice. the past couple weeks ive noticed that if i jiggle my key around while the truck is running it would shut down. had it running for awhile yesterday getting stuck unstuck and stuck again in the mud ended up haveing to push and pull it out with the john Deere well it ran fine all day and today was a little different. i went out cranked er up started right up, warmed up and idled than i went to take it down the road and it didn't run so great, i almost didn't make it back. it would bog down than surge than bog down and surge almost felt as if the engine would backfire than surge and bog down again now it is back in the driveway and it will bog down and stall unless i feather the gas than it will surge and run good and slowly will fall again ans stall unless i give er some gas. it seems like it will run better longer if i hold the key to the right(key has a little play in it ). have any of you ever had any problems with theese old ignitions causin problems. talked to a guy i know up the road and he said he has heard of them wearing out from years of ppl puting huge heavy key rings on there and would cause backfire and not enuff juice to the coil. any help would be appreciated.
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Feb 4, 2010, 7:41 AM
Post #2 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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I don't know the trucks as well but do some. For 1980 was key on dash or on steering column?
The key itself is usually just a remote to the ignition switch if on column and might be integrated if on dash - not sure.
True about the heavy key chain thing. They don't care for that over time. The fact the jiggling key is a clue that problem is with ign switching or at least part of it. Ford went brain dead with ignition switches in the 80s! Recalls and strange problems,
T
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tusseltussel
User
Feb 4, 2010, 8:14 AM
Post #3 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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thanks for the reply tom. it is the switch on the dash, i replaced it this morning but the truck is still acting up, i think the key switch was on its way out because the past few weeks it would shut down if you touched it, but thats not my main problem. keeping the thing running is still a job, im thinking i will check the little filter on the carb its not that old but maybe it got somthing in ther, it almost like it runs good and looses fuel starts to conk out than will pick up again than conk and pick up, but i do have to hold the rpms up a lil bit or it will just conk out. im gonna go pull the filter now and chk it if thats not it im gonna pull the top off the carb see if anythings in there and if i can get it to run long enuff i will watch it with the top off the carb.... could it be just a float adjustment???? idk its holing me up a little bit though
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chickenhouse
Enthusiast
Feb 4, 2010, 9:14 AM
Post #4 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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Didn't get any of thay mud stuck inside the tailpipe did ya? Worth a check? dtdy
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Feb 4, 2010, 9:25 AM
Post #5 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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OK: Switch it is. I just looked up the part and the key seems (errors never happen of course with parts sites) to be a remote to the switch itself with many wires there that plug in. IDK the trucks so well so what I'm guessing is there's a rod that goes to the switch - it showed and I'll post what I found below just $11.99 for that switch! It should be a pill to get at but somehow my guess is it's not that bad!
Some old Fords with key in dash I've messed with you could have installed a new key and switch faster than breaking it to steal them! Just kidding but some WAY back weren't hard to jump or mess with. It may require removing the key part to do this - tool for that and if memory serves me I think long needle nose pliers will do in most cases.
Again - since just touching that makes a quick and noticeable change it is the problem or a lot of it. Forget the carb for the moment. You mentioned running it with top off so I'm guessing you have some carb expertise as most would freak if you said you could do that!
Testing my memory as they say - "it's the second thing to go." Can't remember what the first was?? (it's a joke!)
Carb kit may be in order but the ign thing is first. Hope carb kit is new as some carbs with older materials don't like the alcohols they use in fuels today. I have good luck with my local NAPA for advise on the parts - the one I deal with is independently owned so they can bitch about their own stuff and get about any brand if they are good at it (it's a trade in itself) at what is currently best.
As you must have found out by now the bargain stuff can be the most expensive to get out of!
Good luck. Trucks should have parts for ions like this. Do let me/us/the world know how it worked out,
T
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Duralast / Ignition Switch For your 1980 Ford Truck F350 1 ton P/U 2WD 5.8L 2BL Modified 8cyl   Price: $11.99
AVAILABILITY: SEND TO STORE LIST SPECIAL ORDER Visit your local store to special order. SHIP TO HOME AVAILABLE Ships within 2 business days.  Part Number: LS503 Weight: 0.35 lbs Quantity Per Car: 1 OEM Number: 12329709; E0TZ- 11572- A; E4TZ- 11572- A; F2TZ- 11572- B; F2TZ- 11572- F; ZZL1- 66- 123A
(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Feb 4, 2010, 9:26 AM)
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tusseltussel
User
Feb 5, 2010, 11:18 AM
Post #6 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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its actually not that switch its the one you can use a paperclip to pop out the cylinder and start it with a screwdriver. i went ahead and pulled the carb off and rebuilt it anyway since its down i figure i may as well replace the power valve and accelerator pump, got it back on now and im puzzled again i went from one problem to another.... now the darn accelorator pump is actin funny its gettin pressure in ther and preventing it from pumping when you hit the gas everythings in proper little plug spring with the big end toward the plug diaphragm in properly its all right i gotta check the spring in the linkage see if it sumhow broke or moved or idk im gonna eat lunch and go look at it in a few.
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Feb 5, 2010, 11:31 AM
Post #7 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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>> it seems like it will run better longer if i hold the key to the right(key has a little play in it ). << Quote from first post.
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The key and the switch are two different things. They key itself is just a key and tummblers and the switching is electrical which is why I was thinking the switch part is one of the issues. Carb could be as well but saying that holding the key made a difference had me off to it being a primary issue,
T
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tusseltussel
User
Feb 5, 2010, 12:14 PM
Post #8 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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i think the key switch was on its way out i replaced it and it didn't help it was on its way out anyway so a 17 dollar fix its done but that isn't my problem now. maybe i was just hoping it was running better when i held the key to the right but it was in fact shutting the truck down when you would jiggle it so its been replaced.... now i gotta figure out why the acc pump is not working properly everything was blown out with choke cleaner and compressed air it just isn't pushing in when the linkage is moved if you push it in you can hear it spray it just wont move with the linkage and wont start lukily i can take it off and apart again without messing up the gaskets and see what i find i have another carb on the shelf if i need to i can rebuild it and put it on but i would like to figure out whats wrong with this one first i can't imagin what it is ther isn't that much to them old 2150 carbs thanks for the input but now i created a bunch of other problems i guess. at leas i could get it started before...
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Feb 5, 2010, 4:42 PM
Post #9 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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Carbs: That accelerator pump probably has a bar that can be bent to adjust and a 'conical' spring that returns it so it's ready to pump a squirt again.
Not much to the whole carb as I recall which might not be much - don't agree too much with that please
I get the drift you have a clue about carbs. Top, middle and bottom each with their own purpose. Trucks seemed a few years delayed on stupid stuff of the last cars that prevented or made difficult to adjust anything.
Don't have it, but things that go wrong can include..... Floats too heavy, saturated with fuel and can be weighed to spec or I recall can be dried if composite - also if you know how to run it with top off could be adjusted to the new weight if not too excessive.
Idle adjustment screws. They control mixture at idle and part throttle only. Bottom one gently counting turns as a reference and remove them - spray carb cleaner thru them a lot till clear and re-install about where they were or about 2.5 to 3 turns out from bottom if no reference.
Choke must be set and I recall the black housing was indexed. You can use judgement for one or two marks and it still must be wide open fairly soon after start up from cold AND crack open with initial start - perhaps 1/4 or less inch as measured with a drill bit - front plate again air horn wall.
If choke is heated with exhaust heat then it has a trickle vacuum leak inside to draw up warm/hot air and may need to be cleared out. Electrics would feel warm on housing by the touch with just key on, engine off. If exhaust heated the gasket must be good between housing and carb metal, a thing ~2" round gasket.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Other - check if known original the timing chain lash. Most were using nylon cam gears and they didn't age well or plain wore out even with intense care. Two tricky ways to check it is watch manifold vacuum with a gauge with an in-line "T" and or put to TDC, remove dist cap, watch how many degrees it can turn via crankshaft bolt before rotor of distributor turns. 5 is plenty and more will start issues. Vacuum should read a steady 18+ Hg at idle. Uniformly low is a problem unless higher altitude you can deduct 1 Hg for each 1,000 ft of elevation +/-.
Being a truck, fan clutch may be screwed on water pump - dunno for sure but could be reverse threaded so watch if you go there.
Keep checking and reporting. One of us old pharts will finally remember just what is what!
T
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tusseltussel
User
Feb 5, 2010, 5:13 PM
Post #10 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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ok, i figured that all out is working properly now the carb at least, thats all good now at least i had the kit layin on a shelf and am down no money on that...... still no start so i checked to see if i had power to the coil and thats good, checked for spark and nothin... plugged in a spare working box up on the fender for the electric ignition still no spark, cap and rotor look good , distributor does turn when you crank the engine so thats good wouldn't want to deal with that right now,,,, so only thing left is the pickup coil, which was replaced like 2 years ago... iguess it could have just been a bad part, maybe that surging was the p\u coil breakin down. you remember correctly there is not much to that carb at all. floats too heavy ive seen em before where they had a pinhole in em and got weighed down with gas but i should have known it was electrical it seems like most times i think its fuel related its a week spark or something electical, will let ya know what i find out in the morning
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tusseltussel
User
Feb 6, 2010, 10:59 AM
Post #11 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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well its fixed. hears what happened, it was in the distributer, i guess with age and wear there is a small roll pin that holds the star gear on the distributor shaft to operate the pickup coil well that pin wasn't there i found half of it laying in the distriutor housing but because it wasn't in place that star gear was spining uncontrolled and that must have been why i was getting that surging and burnt out p\u coil . the good news is now the carb is working better than ever and the engine doesn't cut out if you jiggle the key or hit a big bump. you have been a big help tom and i thank you, even if your memory is not what it used to be your a huge help to many people on this forum and i hope you keep up the good work.
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Feb 7, 2010, 4:31 AM
Post #12 of 12
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Re: ignition switch problem???
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Good work! Nice find.
Tussel - True story from circa 1978, working at a gas station also doing repairs the owner/boss had a 20k mile timing chain all apart with a no run condition and he was a sharp mechanic. OK - being the new kid then I'm scratching my head thinking NO!
Long story short - it was that roll pin COMPLETELY SHEARED! Dist rotor didn't turn at all! The truck wasn't very old then and a small block 302 or 351W (I still speak cubic inches - laugh) -- that was the only time in a career I ever heard of it but saw it. Honest shop - customer got a free no nylon timing chain out of it (whiz ding ~$20 bucks back then)
I still check with vehicles with distributors that rotor does turn since then and all have.
Again - good for you for finding that. Dang 5cent roll pin stops the show!
T
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