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1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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spongebue
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Jul 21, 2009, 1:31 AM
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1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Hey guys,
First off, here's the standard car info, even if some of it is probably not relevant:
1995 Oldsmobile Cutlass Ciera SL
3.1L V6 Engine
~95,000 miles (not bad, eh? :P )
So, the main thing that's been bugging me is the Cruise Control. Not only because it doesn't work when I want it to, but by gawd, I've tested (and replaced) just about everything. It really should work. Here's my story: (I know some things may seem out of order, but some of it is based on ideas I had at the time or lack thereof) - Brian finds out Cruise Control is working
- Brian checks to see if there is a cruise fuse in the glove compartment fuse box (didn't see one)
- Brian finds Alldata flowchart on repairing cruise unit:
- If speedo doesn't work, replace vehicle speed sensor. Otherwise, check for about 5 volts on Pin K of the cruise module (I thought this was main power to the module, and was surprised when I still got power with it switched off inside)
- Got about 7.2 volts (which goes to about 8 when the engine is started)
- If not 5 volts, check for open circuit for pin K
- During a trip to a junkyard, Brian found a "new" cruise module as well as switch, only $9 each
- Brian replaces his parts with junkyard parts
- Brian is increasingly upset at this, and thinks he has a wiring issue
- Brian talks in the third person to relieve this stress
- Brian gives up for a while, but then lives in a dorm in the summer time in a college town, with little else to do but look at his car again
- Brian finds a book at the library with testing instructions on just about every pin for this cruise unit
- All tests work for Brian, aside from the voltage issue on the VSS
- Brian does a test that seems to be a diagnostic test for the cruise, involving the parking brake, regular brake, set button, and R/A. A bad speed sensor connection will cause it to rev a bit, a bad cruise module will have it do nothing
- The engine revved, but very slightly. Something you'd expect when releasing the brake and putting slightly less stress on the engine
- Thinking he may have gotten a bad junkyard cruise control module, Brian tried once more with a second one at a different junkyard
- Brian gets very frustrated, and posts here
Ok, maybe I went a little overboard with that, sorry  . Other problems I have (I'll be more brief about this) in case anyone has ideas:
Temperature gauge is not working, not the sending unit at fault (tried shorting that spot with a paper clip, which simulates a hot engine with a low resistence. The needle stayed there. Before, it'd indicate a very hot engine for a couple seconds, usually when I'd be accelerating. Then it died completely (that, or I've had a very cold engine for a long time now 
Finally, the ABS is no good. Light goes on after I drive a few feet, though it takes a little longer when I'm going in reverse. I think it's a wheel speed sensor (dad may have done a scan, I forget for sure). Problem is, it's built into the wheel bearing, I think it was, so it's a pain to replace. If anyone has other ideas of what it could be, I'm all for ideas.
Thanks a lot, guys! If anyone can successfully say what's wrong and is in the Minneapolis/Western Wisconsin area, I swear I'll buy you a 6-pack or something :P
-Brian
(This post was edited by spongebue on Jul 21, 2009, 2:22 AM)
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Loren Champlain Sr
Veteran
/ Moderator
Jul 21, 2009, 2:28 PM
Post #2 of 13
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Brian; You didn't mention stopping for a beer. That's where you went wrong. Enjoyed your story! Sorry, can't add any wisdom to it!
Loren
SW Washington
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spongebue
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Jul 21, 2009, 2:38 PM
Post #3 of 13
(6708 views)
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Well, unfortunately, I only turned 21 a couple weeks ago. Ahem, I'm not going to comment about whether or not that's actually stopped me 
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Double J
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Jul 21, 2009, 2:44 PM
Post #4 of 13
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Double J has a thought!
Check the High Level Stop Lamp ..If its inoperative,it will keep the cruise control from working ..at least on some GM models it does,not sure on this one....
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spongebue
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Jul 21, 2009, 2:53 PM
Post #5 of 13
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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High level stop lamp? You mean, the top brake light? (I'm probably way off, but that's the best I can think of). I actually checked those for an unrelated reason a few months ago, well after I had cruise control issues. Or wait, do you mean the one in the back window? That I have not checked in, well, ever. Hmmm...
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Double J
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Jul 21, 2009, 2:59 PM
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Yes,the one in the back window....could be as simple as a blown bulb(s)
Let us know
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spongebue
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Jul 21, 2009, 3:28 PM
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Well, I'll be damned, that light isn't turning on (I'm assuming it's tied in with the regular brake lights, which are on... I just used something to hold down the brake without having the car in motion)
brb, Wal Mart (hoping they have the bulb, otherwise O'Reilly tomorrow) 
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spongebue
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Jul 21, 2009, 4:17 PM
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Good news: That set of lights now works just fine, and I'm less likely to be rear-ended by someone.
Bad news: No luck with the cruise.
Would it help you guys any if I scanned the set of schematics I have, maybe a transcript of the troubleshooting steps?
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spongebue
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Jul 22, 2009, 5:20 PM
Post #9 of 13
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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I know I only barely mentioned the issue, but kinda strange thing happened to me today. I was trying to make a left arrow, so I sped up a little bit, took the turn a little fast. As I did that, I could swear I heard the noise from the dash that I always hear when the ABS light comes on. I looked down, and the light was off. Maybe it was off prior to that, I didn't really notice (hard to notice problems that are always there )
Anyway, I thought it was either a lucky fluke, or a burned out bulb. When I arrived at my destination a few blocks later, I shut off the engine and tried again. It turned on for the bulb test, then off. Ok, that's not uncommon, usually it comes on after a few feet. I drove a few feet more. And a few feet more. That light still didn't come on. I've since driven maybe 10 miles, and it seems like the car just wanted attention this whole time. I haven't really been able to truly test it in summer, but if the light is off there's not much I can do, right?
Now, if only the same thing would happen with the cruise control and temperature gauge :P
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Double J
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Jul 22, 2009, 5:35 PM
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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May have been fixed with the CHMSL bulb replacement. (Center High Mount Stop Lamp).
You mentioned Dad may have scanned for codes?Does he remember the code(s)?
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Double J
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Jul 22, 2009, 6:04 PM
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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On the Temp Gauge...you sure you checked the correct switch?
There should be a Temperature Switch for the gauge and a Coolant Temperature Sensor for the computer.
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spongebue
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Jul 23, 2009, 1:14 AM
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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IF my dad did test it (I honestly can't remember if this was an educated guess or he did an actual scan) it was the wheel speed sensor. I honestly have my doubts that it was the stop lamp that did it, since I do remember it being on right after that. I remember reading (I think this was on a '95 Ciera) that if there is no ABS trouble code given 100 times when the car goes at least 10MPH, it will essentially do a reset on that system and the light will go off. My dad worked on the regular brakes about a month ago, maybe he accidentally did something that took care of it? I know it's a little farfetched, but 100 starts since then does sound about right.
As for the temp gauge, it wasn't me that tested it directly, to be honest. My roommate's friend is a mechanic by trade, and he's pretty familiar with GMs. He's the one that found the spot and shorted it, I turned the key and checked it. I would think that if it were the sensor for the computer that we got, it would flash a temperature warning light, wouldn't it? Even still, I later found out that my dad already tried replacing it. (handy guy, he is )
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spongebue
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Aug 2, 2009, 5:54 PM
Post #13 of 13
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Re: 1995 Olds Cutlass Ciera - Cruise Control head-scratcher (with bonus issues!)
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Boy, thanks for the tip, above poster robot thing! I'll be sure never to check it out.
Anyway, update to the story, continued entirely in third-person bullet points as you folks seemed to enjoy.
- Brian decides that it must be the gauge at fault, based on his test with jumping the temperature sending unit connector with a paper clip not doing anything
- Brian replaces gauge with a new one (again from the junkyard, $4 + $2 admission)
- Brian turns key to run position, and the gauge changes position majorly
- This greatly excites Brian, though in a clean non-sexual way (not that big of a car junky, sorry to say
- He then corrects the needle's position to point to a more logical position, since the engine was cold
- When Brian drove around, the gauge didn't move any more, just when the key was turned and it had time to move a bit since the last startup
- Getting fed up with this, Brian pulls out the instrument panel (for a second time after replacing the gauge) and solders a few wires to the gauge (thank god for alldata and some schematics laying around) to simulate a normal environment
- 12 volts and ground applied to their respective places; temperature input going to ground via a potentiometer
- Test was successful, the gauge worked fine (being able to turn that potentiometer and control the gauge is more fun than it should be, and Brian's dad agrees)
- Brian checks for continuity between the wire on the sending unit connector and where it ends up when connecting to the instrument panel; all is good.
- Knowing that all connections seem solid up to the temperature sending unit, Brian has no other choice but to replace that
- His dad said he tried that already, but started to question himself the more he talked. Even for Brian's dad, this is unusual
- Brian's dad replaces the sensor (it's in too awkward of a place for Brian to do on his own, but his dad is a former mechanic)
- He has enough trouble doing so that he admits that he would have remembered doing it if it were so difficult.
- Brian drives 100 miles back to school in Wisconsin, and sees the temperature gauge creep up the more he drives, right up to a point just before the halfway marker.
- Brian is happy to have 2 problems taken care of (albeit one mysteriously) with one more to go
Next up, cruise control once and for all. I realized that I copied the section from the J-body, rather than A-body, which uses a very similar (but not quite the same) system... They're in the same grouping in the book, but when it comes to detailed instructions, A-body comes first. Why they put the J-body schematic right before the A-body, which is on the page after, I have no idea. Anyway, I'm going to look at every connection, make sure it's all clear, and highlight each part I examine until there's nothing left. With a little (ok, a LOT) of luck, this will be done (and working) before I go to Indiana on Thursday. 500 mile trip each way with no cruise control. I've done it before, not fun.
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