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Chry with P0351 and P1391 at same time


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dstun
New User

Apr 21, 2022, 7:58 AM

Post #1 of 5 (268 views)
Chry with P0351 and P1391 at same time Sign In

Hi my gf said she was driving to work a few days ago when she said her engine light came on and had a big loss of performance. She actually works in a small independent auto repair shop. I use to be a mechanic myself but am now disabled. For a number of months now she said they told her the timing belt was bad because it was hitting the timing cover. I told her to stop driving the car and tell them to fix it if this was the case. But she refused to listen to me. They delayed working on her vehicle and correcting some other issues she had and they didn't fix correctly. (waiting on a unnecessary part). I have a lot of reserves about this shop from what I heard goes on their and my own family taking their vehicles their. Apparently two codes triggered at the same time. A po351 and a p1391. So the shop owner took a look at it when she said she wasn't driving it home or on parts or customer runs. I believe this is a 1998 Plymouth Breeze. with either a 2.0 or 2.4l. Not sure if its a single or duel overhead cam. Now apparently the shop owner said it was a bent cover causing the noise she had when they told her it was a timing belt and a bad ign coil. They replaced the coil and so far no codes came back and she said it runs smoother then it ever ran. But she was freaking out and wanting to have the cam or crank sensor replaced. Her boss told her not to do that yet and see if the code comes back. But she just messaged me finally with the specific codes instead of just some rough information. I know the P0351 deals with the ign coil and the P1391 deals with a potential cam or crank sensor, its wiring, or timing issue such as the belt. Unfortunately I don't have access to the trouble charts. So I don't know if this combination of codes could simply be from just a bad coil itself. I tired doing some web searches but some of the info seems a little dotted. I know while it can happen, I do have a hard time believing both codes triggered at the same time with both systems failing at the same time. I was to believe that this was just a ign coil failure as it so far seems to fix the problem. I also understand at-least with some other similar cam/crank codes a bad misfire could potentially trigger it, but haven't seen info online about it with these two codes together, or at-least the P1391 code specifically. Can a ign oil or misfire trip the p1391 or this combination mean it was just the ign coil being faulty? Or did she get very unlucky to have both systems fail at the same time? I guess I could also think of a other possible explanation of the engine running so rough with a bad timing belt that was loose enough to cause it to trip the P1391 code. I believe these were the only codes.


(This post was edited by dstun on Apr 21, 2022, 8:00 AM)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Apr 21, 2022, 8:31 AM

Post #2 of 5 (262 views)
Re: Chry with P0351 and P1391 at same time Sign In

I don't really see a relationship between the 2 codes. The P1391 indicates an intermittent loss of signal from either the Crank or Cam sensor. They do have a lot of trouble with cam sensors on this engine but I think I would wait for this to develop further before jumping to any conclusions.

As for the timing belt, this is an interference engine so I would definitely look into the recommended interval for a belt on this.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Apr 21, 2022, 8:35 AM)


dstun
New User

Apr 21, 2022, 10:22 AM

Post #3 of 5 (252 views)
Re: Chry with P0351 and P1391 at same time Sign In

Thank you Hammer Time. Yes, I was getting that conclusion too about these sensors commonly going bad on these engines from what I was reading to. And yes, like you mentioned these are interference engines hence why I told her she shouldn't be driving it till she had it checked out properly or fixed. But I think I did convince her not to jump in and just replace the sensors being her boss did tell her the same thing.
So you think that this was just bad coincidence that both of these systems had a fault or code at the same exact time? I was kind of debating of having her have her boss do the checks such as resistance and oscilloscope checks. I would assume that they have an oscilloscope and know how to use it and do this. But it wouldn't surprise me in the least if they didn't (assuming they need to compare cam and crank values for proper diagnosis). I been out of the industry for a good number of years now, so I'm not up to date on all the current systems.


(This post was edited by dstun on Apr 21, 2022, 10:24 AM)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Apr 21, 2022, 10:29 AM

Post #4 of 5 (245 views)
Re: Chry with P0351 and P1391 at same time Sign In

I think the first thing I would do is find out if it is actually due for a timing belt. If so, get that done first and see if it corrects anything. A jumped tooth in the belt might cause those codes. Other than that I would probably wait for this thing to set some sort of pattern and be more consistent with the failure.

You really can't be sure these codes set simultaneously. The P1391 may not have even put the light on.

My biggest worry would be the belt right now. If it has issues it could trigger codes.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



dstun
New User

Apr 21, 2022, 10:41 AM

Post #5 of 5 (240 views)
Re: Chry with P0351 and P1391 at same time Sign In

Oh really? I would have assumed the P1391 would have defiantly tripped the light. This explains a lot. And yes that is my concern too. Thank you so much.






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