I came across this site about how water can be used as a gas, are there anyone of you have tried this? http://www.h2ofuel.sx.am/

Didn't even check out the site because it's all a hoax. Water is simply hydrogen and oxygen makes H2O. If you can get just the hydrogen out it's a great fuel. Trouble is it takes more energy to get it out of water than using the energy directly. If you will - it would be like putting a wind mill on your car to make electricity but you use more power to move the car then the electricity made,

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

I like your cat. What's it's name?

Kitty keeps her name private as she doesn't want too much attention from the papparazzi as she is the web's car kitty! All I can say is she's a 2002 Balimese and under the witness protection program as she knows too much about some government scandals

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

Greenleaf's right. Back in college, we tried to 'investigate' this water-as-fuel phenomena (that was back in the 80's), and yep, splitting those molecules require much more energy than what double atoms of Hydrogen would give.

Still, an inventor from Asia (I think it was from the Philippines or Vietnam) used water to somehow "dilute" gas and make it still effective. It's not water per se, but water as a fuel additive. It was effective and true, but their government, being the third world country it is, didn't support the inventor. Sad, sad, sad. :p

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I'm a Thunderbird-ridin' maniac.

Classic cars for sale! Find all classic cars from Alfa Romeo to Ford to Volkswagen to Willys.

You've been busy tonite richardquarrel! Just read the basics of Isaac Newton's theories and the answers have been there all that long. Not a single change since then,

Smile!

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston












(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on May 10, 2008, 1:09 AM)

That all we need.... a car that runs off hydrogen, a bomb on wheels Bin-Ladin would love that.

We already know how nice hydrogen is in transportation! If I recall this was just hydrogen to LIFT the air ship not to propell it. The US wouldn't sell them helium. Gasoline is bad enough - imagine tanks of this stuff on the roads!

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

YOU KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT....THE BIG BANG THEORY not in space but on the roads, I did like science in school back when.

(This post was edited by JIM N on May 11, 2008, 12:34 AM)

Kitty is happy to just stay home and avoid all this!

T & K
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

ok i read this cuz i've been posting stuff about this subject. see i made a hydrogen electrolizer which is a safe and relitivly easy thing to make. i didn't think it would work eiather but i built one anyways. i got such good results that i'm building 2 more for my 97 grand am gt. see the hydrogen oxygen bond gets broken and it creates hho. which is waters h2o split up into its own particals. when sucked through the intake alerts your computer to slow down your injectors cuz there is more fuel in the air. which inturn cuts back on the amount of gas used. and it gives you better hp. it burns hho and converts it back to h2o. i got one 2in pvc on my 97 lumina 3.1 and i got an increse of 20% in fuel economy and about 10% hp. and not only that but a guy i know also did his 94 chevy silverado which used to get 12mpg with 2 made out of 4 in pvc and now he's gettin 24mpg. if your vehical has a computer on it you can put one on but for carborators they don't work that great but they will give you a boost in hp.now i do know what ya'll are talkin about which is these new cars that run on hydrogen. that is a bad source of hydrogen in the first place cuz its derived from gas oil or coal and the by products are harmful. they burry the waste like nuclear waste. but yeah your car burns cleaner but where it comes from aint clean. watch this video and see how its made. try it if you want. but it does work for me and alot of people i build these things for. and the cool thing is you can build it for about $30.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=kqL5Sur7LtE

Gees Darrin! Just what are you sniffin lately?

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston












(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Jun 29, 2008, 6:29 PM)

nothing really. lol. just the gas companies fat wallet. but yeah i got another video that is good too. this is from the same guy that made the other one in the last video but it shows the rest of the set up plus a better eletrolizer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYxqvhzVie8

this is more like the one i'm putting in my grand am. i went to new york and back and alot of people looked at me funny when i went to fill up the tank but once they heard how much better we got wanted to know where they could get one. but the ones you buy can go for like 500 and up. this one here you can build your self for around 30 bucks. i've had alot of people tell me it wouldn't work but i disagree with them cuz i got one on my car and i've seen what it does. i can't argue with what i see. lol. my lumina went from getting 400 miles per tank to 662 mpt. it works.

LMAO!!!!


That is freaking hysterical! Kitty on super glue!

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

Darrin,

I too have a Lumina and am in the process of installing an HHO system. It is encouraging to see your results. What adjustments, if any, did you have to
make with the O2 sensor and/or MAP sensor to see the increase?

Thanks, Rick


(This post was edited by K6RJ on Jul 18, 2008, 4:41 PM)

Enough of this nonsense - it's a hoax! Does anyone really think you can just grab a bunch of PVC hardware and burn water in your engine? It's the PVC glue that's got you!

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

Back in the days of recip engines C97), we had to use adi to boost our torque enough to reach take-off speed. Usually this was on hot dry days in Texas. It was an alcohol-water injection. So I can sort of believe the far- easterner may just have a formula similar to what I just described in adi. It would be nice if someone could figure it out and not hurt an engine. Maybe the Air Force can inform us. Go for it.

Not an aviation tech but I believe that was/is a method to control and or assist the atomization of real fuel more than a fuel itself,

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

hi, hydro cars are an interesting invention, actually its up to you if you want to believe that it exist.


(link removed - don't believe this junk IMO)

(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Sep 16, 2009, 5:17 PM)

Dear nashcardude, There has been a lot of talk of water injection. Does anyone know of data from a credible source?
I suggest:
1) the water will not burn in the conditions of engines, so this will not add to the fuel value or mileage. In order to get the energy out from burning the hydrogen in the water, you must first put the same energy into the water to break it apart into hydrogen and oxygen.
2) the alcohol will burn and add to the fuel, but is may be insignificant. It would probably be insignificant because the amount of alcohol added would be say a quart per several gas tank fills. (as I understand the concept).
3) the vaporization of the liquid water and alcohol would theoretically cool the cylinder, valves, and exhaust gasses. I do not know how significant this would be. It depends on the amount of water injected. 5 gal a tankful would probably be significant. A quart would not.

So here is my question #1: I think I have heard (but don't remember the source- so this is of almost no credibility) that water was injected into WWII airplane engines to cool the exhaust valves because the engines were run very hard and hot. Supposedly this cooled the exahust valves enough to make them last longer. Does this make any sense to any of you? I have long been curious about the concept.

Questin #2 I wonder if water injecting could increase the mileage of a car, because of the vaporization of the water by waste heat. On the one hand, you can't get something for nothing because any cooling of the exploding gas would reduce the pressure& force on the top of the piston.

Question#3: Is there any inherent advantage to the combustion reaction in having steam in the combustion chamber? One possibility comes to mind. US gar engines are run very rich to reduce the combustion temperatue so they product less NOx pollutant in the exhaust? Might a reduction in temperature or improvement in the combustion reactions lead to lower NOx while eliminating the need for the extra/rich fuel? You cannot creat energy, but the idea is that the energy that was wasted in catalytically 'burning' this extra/ rich mixture, would be recovered in the milage? Without doing the calculations, my guess that the difference between 'rich' and 'lean' is about 10%. Any one have data?

Question#3: I wonder what would happen if the exhaust system was used to make steam and run a small auxiliary engine. For example in a hybrid car, would the extra electricity be worth the complexity to have an auxiliary exhaust-run engine and generator? Maybe I should just do the calculations to see if any of these questions/ ideas are any good.
Anyone have any data or thoughts?Regards, Brad

The waste in combustion engined cars is in heat! If that could be converted to steam that could turn a device for the power it would be a great move in the right direction.

I think that there's enough lost energy in the heat to run an alternator and combined with more LED lighting would be a substantial savings as current lighting uses more than we realize in energy in cars!

T
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Tom Greenleaf - MetroWest, Boston

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