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Delay engaging in drive


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bpen1977
User

Dec 3, 2016, 9:46 PM

Post #1 of 20 (854 views)
  post locked   Delay engaging in drive  

I have a 2008 Saturn Vue XR, 3.6L, 130K. When shifting vehicle into drive, there is a 2-3 second delay before the transmission engages. The shift seems firmer than it was before but not clunky or excessive. I have always thought that this transmission felt soft or spongy when engaging and shifting. I checked the trans fluid level and it was in range. I went ahead and drained trans fluid in pan and refilled until back in range (5 qts). Drained fluid looked and smelled real good and there was no metal on drain plug magnet. At 63K, 2 weeks out of manufacturer 6 yr warranty, wave plate went out, so current fluid that i drained only had 67K on it. After negotiating, GM covered 2/3 cost of wave plate repair. Doing the drain and refill did not change problem. I also disconnected battery for 30 mins while having key turned on to try to reset things to see if that would resolve issue but it did not. It is not triggering any codes. I am not quite sure where to go from here. Thanks for your help.


gsferraro
Enthusiast

Dec 4, 2016, 11:39 AM

Post #2 of 20 (836 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Hello,
This is a 6 speed transmission called a 6T70, Do you have a check engine light on? wondering if any trouble codes are stored? If only a delay in drive, you could have an issue with your 1-2-3-4 clutch or a lazy solenoid. Does the car react the same cold and hot? Gary


bpen1977
User

Dec 4, 2016, 8:43 PM

Post #3 of 20 (822 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Thank You Gary for the reply. I have never had it trigger a check engine light. I have done 2 separate obd code scans just to make sure there was nothing there and have come up empty both times. The delay is pretty consistent hot and cold. Delay might be slightly shorter when warm but we are talking maybe 1/2 second difference. Is always in the 2-3 second range regardless of vehicle temp.


gsferraro
Enthusiast

Dec 5, 2016, 4:10 AM

Post #4 of 20 (816 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Hello,
Question, Do you know if your scanning the Transmission control module(TCM) which is located inside the transmission? What type of scanner are you using? Gary


bpen1977
User

Dec 5, 2016, 4:47 AM

Post #5 of 20 (807 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

I don't know for sure if the first scan (done by auto zone) looks at TCM but the second scan done with scanner borrowed from friend did not read tcm I do not believe. My dad has a scanner and I believe his might read tcm but i will text him later today and find out for sure. If so, i will try to get it and hook it up.


gsferraro
Enthusiast

Dec 5, 2016, 5:37 AM

Post #6 of 20 (802 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Ok that would be great, im just wondering if there are any codes, some codes can store and not turn the check engine light on. Gary


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Dec 5, 2016, 5:53 AM

Post #7 of 20 (799 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

I seriously doubt Autozone is reading the TCM.

I doubt ANY free scan is going to do that.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Dec 5, 2016, 5:54 AM)


bpen1977
User

Dec 7, 2016, 7:53 AM

Post #8 of 20 (763 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

I have ordered a scan tool that will read TCM since the cost of scan at tranny shop was about the same cost as getting a tool that will do it. Tool should arrive tomorrow or Friday. As soon as I get it I will scan and let you know what it shows.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Dec 7, 2016, 7:57 AM

Post #9 of 20 (761 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Great, now all you need is the years of experience and equipment it takes to troubleshoot a code to determine the actual cause of the trouble code. I hope you don't think that pulling a code is actually diagnosing a problem. That is just the beginning.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



bpen1977
User

Dec 7, 2016, 1:42 PM

Post #10 of 20 (744 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

No argument from me with anything you said, Hammer Time. I fully understand that pulling a code is only a starting place for diagnosing a problem, but it's a decent place to start. I am not opposed to taking it to a professional if it comes to that point, but there are a lot of things you can take care of yourself if you are willing to take the time to dig a little, educate yourself, and use available resources.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Dec 7, 2016, 3:16 PM

Post #11 of 20 (734 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

That's true.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



bpen1977
User

Dec 8, 2016, 6:41 PM

Post #12 of 20 (705 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Scan turned up 1 transmission code. P0877: TFP switch 4 circuit low voltage.


bpen1977
User

Dec 9, 2016, 10:56 AM

Post #13 of 20 (688 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

So this is where I tend to go with this information, please correct me if I am wrong. This seems to lead me to something on the TEHCM/solenoid unit vs something in the valve body. Those seemed to me be the most likely causes. With the code containing a low voltage component, combined with the fact that my fluid was very clean when drained, gives me little reason to suspect a more physical problem like an obstruction within the valve body. It seems to me to be most likely in the TCM/Solenoid unit. With the TCM and solenoid block sold together as 1 unit, it negates the need to try to fully isolate whether or not it is a TCM issue or solenoid issue or try to narrow down to individual solenoid or switch.


Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Discretesignals profile image

Dec 9, 2016, 2:29 PM

Post #14 of 20 (680 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

I did one of those on a Buick Lacrosse a while back that had that code. It ended up being the valve body pressure switches little plastic flappers were coming apart.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-LI7EVvE7c



It is so common that Sonnax came out with a kit to rebuild the switches:

http://www.sonnax.com/...nstallation-tool-kit




GM came out with a PI for that:

Service Information Home Publications Number Search New Bulletins Bulletin Search Feedback Help 2007 GMC Truck Acadia - AWD | Acadia VIN R/V Service Manual | Document ID: 2637076

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

#PI0448: Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) Illuminated, DTC P0752, P0872, P0877 and/or P0989 Set - (Apr 21, 2011) Subject: Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) Illuminated, DTC P0752, P0872, P0877 and/or P0989 Set

Models: 2008-2011 Buick Enclave 2010-2011 Buick LaCrosse 2010-2011 Cadillac SRX 2008-2011 Chevrolet Equinox, Malibu 2009-2011 Chevrolet Traverse 2007-2011 GMC Acadia 2010-2011 GMC Terrain 2008-2010 Pontiac G6 2007-2010 Saturn OUTLOOK 2008–2009 Saturn AURA 2008–2010 Saturn VUE Equipped with 6T70 or 6T75 (RPOs MH2, MH4, MH6 or MY9) Automatic Transmission

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Condition/Concern Some customers may comment that the MIL is illuminated. Upon further investigation, technicians may find DTC P0752, P0872, P0877 and/or P0989 as an active or history code in the TCM.



This condition may be caused by a faulty fluid pressure switch. This switch is part of the Valve, Control Solenoid Assembly (TEHCM) (#15 in illustration above). Damaged switches typically do not occur until the vehicle has accrued 80,000 km (50,000 mi) or more.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.

(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Dec 9, 2016, 2:31 PM)


bpen1977
User

Dec 9, 2016, 6:09 PM

Post #15 of 20 (654 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

That would be easy enough. Do you happen to remember ballpark of what the cost was for that.


Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Discretesignals profile image

Dec 9, 2016, 6:29 PM

Post #16 of 20 (648 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

The TCM/pressure switch body is around $670 list from the dealer; P/N 24267181. Our shop charged around 4 hours labor at $80/hr. We didn't have the capability of programming the TCU, so went sent it to the dealer for that. We were able to replace it without removing the transmission on the LaCrosse, so that was nice. I remember that it had delayed engagement and it shifted odd along with those codes.

We replaced the whole unit and didn't do the Sonax rebuild. Don't know how much the Sonax kit is or how much labor is involved in that job.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.


bpen1977
User

Dec 9, 2016, 8:24 PM

Post #17 of 20 (635 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Thank you so much for your help. I appreciate it.


gsferraro
Enthusiast

Dec 10, 2016, 3:20 PM

Post #18 of 20 (619 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Hello,
I just rebuilt tehcm that had 3 out of the 4 pressure switches no good, the laminate disc falls apart, but i did not drive the car, i had the manager drive it, i will ask him if there was any driveabilty issue, it had 3 pressure switch codes. the car was a 2008 saturn outlook, 6T70 trans. Gary


bpen1977
User

Dec 10, 2016, 7:48 PM

Post #19 of 20 (606 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

I am having a very difficult time finding the gaskets for the cover and also the TEHCM. I think I am going to order the Sonnax kit and plan To do the pressure switch repair unless I pull it and the pressure switches all look great. In which case I will order the complete TEHCM. Considering it is such a common failure and only $50 for the repair kit and tools, kind of hard to go wrong.


bpen1977
User

Dec 19, 2016, 11:41 AM

Post #20 of 20 (555 views)
  post locked   Re: Delay engaging in drive  

Quick update, I pulled the TEHCM this last weekend and 3 of the 4 pressure switches were damaged. I repaired them with the Sonnax repair kit and re-installed TEHCM, but it did not correct the problem so I have ordered a Dorman replacement TEHCM unit and will install that sometime after Christmas I suspect. Thank you all for your help with this.






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