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julianns85
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Mar 8, 2009, 3:27 PM
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2000 Ford F150
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My friend and I are working on his 2000 Ford F150 manual transmission. He hit a motorcycle helmet and damaged his oil tank. After much trouble trying to get it out, we lowered the tranny. Since we had it lowered we decided to replace the clutch as well. We had a lot of trouble getting the tranny back in but finally did. The day after it was all together, the only problem was a couple of censors. Now about 3 days later, the truck will not shift into reverse. We drained the clutch, but it didn't work. Since we did all this we are trying to avoid taking it to a shop. Can anyone help?!?!?!?!?
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Loren Champlain Sr
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Mar 8, 2009, 6:55 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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I'm really hoping that a head wasn't attached to the helmet?
Pretty sure that it is a hydraulic clutch in the Ford. Some can be a real pain to bleed. Most of the Ford clutch kits come with a new slave cylinder. Hopefully, yours did. Bleed the master cylinder, first. Then, move to the slave, and bleed it. Sounds like air in the system, to me.
Loren
SW Washington
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julianns85
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Mar 8, 2009, 8:08 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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Hey. Thanks for the reply. That was my girlfriend trying to write what actually happened (without my consent :) LOL ). BTW There was no head attached, thank god. Anyway, to be more specific, it's the V6 model and we didn't "drain the clutch", lol, we bled the crap out of it though. There was loads of air coming out from beginning to end. I still don't think I got all of the air out. I figure the air in it is causing it to shift poor and even more so not at all in reverse. I was thinking it needs a slave. Does that sound about right? I probably used over a quart of brake fluid bleeding it and air was still coming out it came in spurts. Some pumps it had none then the next it had almost all air coming out. So I finally gave up and said I think he needs a slave. I will try bleeding the master first then the slave but I'm pretty sure they're not connected on this one, and the brake pedal is fine. Oh, also, we never even opened the lines when we did all of this work. The hydraulic clutch line was the only thing we left attached to the tranny when we
"removed" it. We actually just backed it up far enough to do the oil pan, and clutch( disc, pressure plate, throw-out bearing, pilot bearing, and flywheel).
Oh, another thing she didn't mention is that it worked fine for the first day, all gears and everything, the next day was when reverse stopped working. Also, as far as the "sensors" she was talking about, we accidentally broke the cylinder head temp sensor somehow (probably when we were using the prybar to remove the trans)........THANK YOU! Please wbs.
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Loren Champlain Sr
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Mar 9, 2009, 3:43 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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The hydraulic clutch has it's own master cylinder (seperate from the brake master cylinder). When you disconnected the hydraulic line from the trans (slave cylinder), the master cylinder probably drained until it was empty. Just like a brake master cyl., the clutch master has been 'pushed' in the same distance over a number of years. Beyond that point, sediment will build up. If you are not very careful during bleeding, and push the clutch in further than that point, you can rupture the cup on the piston inside the master, due to the buildup of debris/sediment. If this happens, the master will no longer be able to hold pressure, and sometimes, allow it to 'suck' air in from the back. I'm not saying this is what's happened, but it is possible. The slave cylinder should always be replaced when doing a hydraulic clutch. The renewed force of the new pressure plate is very often more than the old slave can handle. But....before you start replacing stuff, bleed the clutch master cylinder first. Depending on it's angle when mounted to the firewall, you may have to take it off and bench bleed it, then remount it, and continue bleeding the slave. Once the master is bled, I prefer to gravity bleed the slave so as to reduce the possibility of damaging the master. Also, depending on the position of the bleeder on the slave, that can be a chore. I'll have to check, but isn't the slave inside the bell housing on this one?
Loren
SW Washington
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julianns85
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Mar 9, 2009, 9:46 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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OK! Thanks for the reply. I've already done that, that was the first thing I did, kind of. I just didn't know that's what it was called(slave master). I thought that was the slave!(the one on the firewall). I guess the only thing I was bleeding was the slave, and yes it is inside the bell housing, but the bleeder sticks out enough to put a wrench on it. So, since all the air that I was getting was coming from that bleeder, on the slave, does that mean more than likely that the slave master is bad? Or the slave itself? Either way, I will start with that tomorrow and let you know. I'll bleed it from the slave master, then gravity bleed it from the slave itself. Correct? The thing I'm most unsure about is 1: if any of this would cause only reverse not to go in gear, which is the whole problem; and 2: if I cannot stop getting air then which one is bad? the slave master or the slave?............Please wbs.....thanks.
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Loren Champlain Sr
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Mar 10, 2009, 3:38 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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Just to be perfectly clear, as old Tricky Dick Nixon would say; Oh, and he wasn't a crook, either. The unit on the firewall is the master cylinder. The unit in the bell housing is the slave cylinder. Yes, do it in that order. The master cylinder, first, then the slave. Be sure to keep the master cylinder full while you are bleeding the slave.
If you can get it into the other gears, you must be getting close. Reverse is a very low gear. If you can't get the clutch to release completely, the input shaft of the transmission won't slow enough to get it into that gear.
I'm really surprised that your clutch kit didn't come with a new slave cylinder. That's gonna suck if you have to pull it all back out to replace that sucker. But, first things, first. If it comes to it, I'd recommend replacing the master cylinder, first. They are relatively inexpensive and are quite simple to replace. You might stick your head up under the dash. You'll see the pushrod that goes from the clutch pedal, into the back of the master cylinder. There will be a rubber boot on the back of the master that the pushrod goes through. Pull the rubber back and see if there is any moisture. If there is, the master needs to be replaced, regardless.
Loren
SW Washington
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julianns85
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Mar 10, 2009, 10:33 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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OK! Thanks...will do that and let you know what happens.....btw....let's say i do all that bleeding and it still doesn't go into reverse....do you think I could just reach through the peephole in the bell housing with a prybar and try prying back to see if that's even the problem?, or just go ahead and replace the slave?
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Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
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Mar 11, 2009, 12:02 AM
Post #8 of 9
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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J - reverse is a different bird. Try shifting it into reverse without the engine running - it should go right in. It may not because clutch isn't disengaging and reverse might grind or difficult vs any forward gear. I didn't think any reverse gears were synchro so would grind if clutch doesn't completely disengage engine. Does this also have that feature where you can't remove the keys without this being in reverse?
It still has a master and or slave issue going on with all that bleeding and no results yet IMO,
T
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Loren Champlain Sr
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Mar 11, 2009, 4:02 PM
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Re: 2000 Ford F150
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I've never tried it before, but if you can somehow move the throwout bearing far enough to disengage the clutch, and it works, then you know that the problem is hydraulic. It won't tell you if it's the slave or master. As said before, I'd replace the master first. To replace the slave, you'll be pulling the trans. But, I wouldn't do either until you are darned sure that all of the air is out of the system. What you are lacking, assuming this isn't a transmission or pilot bushing problem, is throwout fork throw (amount of travel in the fork). Uh, that reminds me. You did replace the pilot bushing/bearing, right?
Loren
SW Washington
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