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Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ?


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mactube
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Jul 10, 2020, 2:50 AM

Post #1 of 15 (197 views)
Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

Do I suck out the oil form the compressor when I eventuate the A/C system ? I want to properly recharge my A/C system ( 09 Jeep Wrangler ) So I will evaluate the system with a vacuum pump, will that suck out the oil in the Compressor ? Do I have to ad the suggested capacity of oil about back into the system after evacuating the system ? … about 3 ounces ?


Tom Greenleaf
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Jul 10, 2020, 3:26 AM

Post #2 of 15 (188 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

For a common vacuum and recharge to specification mind you, the oil stays where it was for the most part. If you wish to add an oz or maybe two depending on what you know has been done thru the years is ok but is a guess.


That guess is just that unless you dump it out of compressors and flush system (toss condensers, driers) it's oil amount doesn't have a dipstick.


Do mark it down under hood for info later for you or the next person can help.


In short the vacuum doesn't remove oil but should remove all gaseous/vapor anything to zero so you know just refrigerant is in there NOT messed up is a base starting point or the end to restoring performance of A/C system. At least you should know it can work if only a short while,


Tom



Hammer Time
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Jul 10, 2020, 3:53 AM

Post #3 of 15 (186 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

The vacuum pump does not remove anything but air and moisture. The oil mixes with the refrigerant so some oil will escape with the refrigerant. That's why most recovery machines will separate it so you can measure how much came out and replace it. As Tom suggested, a couple ounces added back in would usually do the trick, depending on how many components were replaced as some oil will reside in each component.

As for the vacuum pump, most people don't understand the real purpose of doing that. Water will boil at room temp when put under 29" of vacuum so the whole purpose of the vacuum is to boil away all moisture and dry out the system. That's why it is critical to pull a full vacuum and continue it for a period of time, at least 30 minutes.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



mactube
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Jul 10, 2020, 4:17 PM

Post #4 of 15 (159 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

Thanks @Tom Greenleaf @Hammer Time !… as always great advice … exactly what I was looking for !

I actually had to remove the radiator and for some reason accidentally loosened a bold from the A/C Cooler connector , when the connector became loose and refrigerant escaped I tried to tighten it back up but all refrigerant slowly escaped then when I check why it wouldn't seal , I noticed the o-ring was porous and cracked.

Now that everything is sealed and tight and I have to recharge the system I figured I will suck out the oil along with with any moisture in the system by evacuating ( but then again where will the oil go ( into the pump ?)

But ok great since I haven’t replaced any components and the exact amount of oil is not too important I will just top off 1-2 ounces as suggested.


Hammer Time
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Jul 10, 2020, 4:31 PM

Post #5 of 15 (154 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In


Quote
Now that everything is sealed and tight and I have to recharge the system I figured I will suck out the oil along with with any moisture in the system by evacuating


Did you not read what we just posted? You cannot suck anything but air and boiled off moisture with a vacuum pump.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



mactube
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Jul 10, 2020, 8:07 PM

Post #6 of 15 (141 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

Yes I did, my last post was just kind of a recap why I have to recharge the system, to explain, that I didn’t exchange any components.

Totally got it… no oil will be evacuated with the vacuum pump !

Where would I be able to find the pressure that the system will have to be charge with?… since under the hood only the a134 amount is given.


Tom Greenleaf
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Jul 11, 2020, 12:37 AM

Post #7 of 15 (136 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

Slow down - make no mistakes here. You found a leak from an "O" ring, fixed that now just wish to recharge - right? Fine. Vacuum the system down it's empty of all but remaining oil (unknown now what was lost to a leak) as HT said only the "air comes out." That includes any vapors as moisture in air if liquid (think an ice water glass on counter gets wet) isn't leaking that inside a vacuum will boil away and be removed.


The listed charge of 134a is under -hood counts most for the WEIGHT of 134a as a liquid in and under pressure is a liquid can be weighed do understand that.


Like filling a propane bottle it's full of propane either way just forced it's liquid can measure that as weight.


That's what you put back in now because you found a leak some educated guessing how much oil to add? If it made a mess there add a couple oz of specified oil into LOW side of system will circulate when operating and has to or wreck it all!


So yes some oil vacuums out if you did this for fun all the time not the case I hope. Too much oil would choke it so easy and record you did what so you don't keep over adding oil if problems later even a day or next year?? Two years or next owner?? Be nice to the next one :-)
Idea is ONLY THE 134A AND OIL ARE PUT BACK IN THE SYSTEM. YOU CAN MEASURE IN HOW MUCH BY WEIGHT of refrigerant. Oil is marked on containers I doubt you have equipment to dial up this stuff and take a break while it works?
That's it charge to spec and see how it works performance wise. If not up to par then the saga makes lots a long posts and understanding what and where something of 1,000s of things went wrong.


When in doubt ASK and stop where you are you risk costly destruction or get hurt if you misunderstand this is easy to mess up so pay attention + when in doubt STOP.
It's easy yet not speak for myself this equipment gets put away the cold returns and forget it all for 3/4 of the year or so.


MacTube - I'm in New England it gets hot as all hell and cold below zero wild storms and wind too in a blink easy to just move on to current needs not short lived heat that's uncomfortable in a building or car both lack great air circulation before either heat or A/C.


Good luck, the more you pay attention the better luck gets!


Tom



mactube
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Jul 11, 2020, 1:33 AM

Post #8 of 15 (132 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

I understand !

So this is what I did :
- Evacuated the system
- keep vacuum for 45 min ( vacuum readings stayed consistent)
- Felt up system with 18 ounces of a135
- Added 1ounce of Ester oil

A/C is running great now!
I I just would like to find out if I have the proper pressure in the system while A/C is running, since the right amount of refrigerant has been added


Tom Greenleaf
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Jul 11, 2020, 2:13 AM

Post #9 of 15 (125 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

? Why did you use "Ester" oil? I like that oil it's just more popular with "retrofitting" for vehicles OE that were using real Freon meaning R-12 some 1993 and all older - laugh, like my own stuff.
I'm near sure it's compatible or at least OK but some question as to that?


It's working is now the point and hate to say a Jeep/Mopar (nick-name) a bit tough on components IMO funky splits in costly items or hard to fix ends up hacked in like evaporators in dash. If it works and has this long forget it.
I can't argue with it working so if quiet, blowing cool air out a center vent (measure the temp there helps know) if above 80F outside for real should stay in the mid to low 40sF after some time after start up.
It's a Jeep as close as they were to CJs a thing of great affection to many and funky old WWII type designs are fun I must admit.
Best thing is parts should stay available to this just beware of lousy clones now a problem for me whatever silly things I hunt down for popular things of all sorts.


Good luck. See how long it behaves for myself and own vehicles keep a thermo in center vent all the time if not behaving can save a system if not as expected you would destroy a compressor for lack of lube if ignored.


Stay cool,


Tom



Hammer Time
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Jul 11, 2020, 3:58 AM

Post #10 of 15 (122 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In


Quote
Where would I be able to find the pressure that the system will have to be charge with?…


There is no such spec.

Pressures vary with outside temp, blower speed, condenser condition, condenser fan operation, amount of charge, etc. All factors have to be considered when looking at pressures. They will even change with the amount of time the system is running.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Tom Greenleaf
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Jul 11, 2020, 4:46 AM

Post #11 of 15 (116 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

All that I didn't say that! Shame! Look for the incoming air temp in front of the grille - first! Now, when you know system has the correct WEIGHT of charge, turn it on, watch that compressor stays engaged. Now raise idle speed to about 1,500 RPM compressor still engaged it must be warm/hot enough to do this.


Look for high side pressure of pretty dang close to 2.5 times temp in F. you must know incoming air temp in front!! That's all the vehicle knows not some thermos on a tree nearby or a forecast.


You'd be so fooled by time of day sunlight over hot pavement, lack of airflow strong enough some will use powerful fans.


IF lousy conditions where you are working just with a mist of water target the condenser will work better than air to "condense" refrigerant under pressure to a liquid or system would never work.


IF you see charts listing NORMAL pressures don't believe it there are way too many factors involved you have to have a brain on what's around you right then and there not even the next day things would be different.


You really just want the outputs right, center vent, raised idle, no compressor noises. I like to see condensate dripping as well says that isn't freezing but humidity is another 100 pages to factor so no pressure charts will really do,


Tom
___________________________________________________
See chart in controlled environment what temp/pressure does! YOUR VEHICLE IS NOT A CONTROLLED ENVIRONMENT IS HAS A HOT ENGINE TO DEAL WITH TOO :-)





(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Jul 11, 2020, 5:16 AM)


mactube
User

Jul 11, 2020, 2:46 PM

Post #12 of 15 (88 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

@Tom Greenleaf regarding the oil.. you know how that ist… at pep boys they just to know to much when you ask them for recommendations and I don’t have you guys with me all the time lol… and thanks for the charts .. thats really helpful

( hopefully the attached pictures will show ) so you can see the low pressure side showed about 65 psi at 75F outside on the Jeep but then when I opens the valves real quick just to check if everything shows correct it looks just like the gages in the other pick when they I hooked them up on the Camaro .. just 0 both a/c are working find but more like 60F not below 40F as suggested. @Hammer Time that makes sense, since there wouldn’t really be a way to regulate the pressure manually with just the a134 cans and the gauges…

(sorry still can’t upload pix here only links)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/no6nou56cunekij/1aa.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ki3g6wjvj441fab/2aa.jpg?dl=0


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jul 11, 2020, 2:52 PM

Post #13 of 15 (84 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

I don't know what you are trying to show us here but one picture only has pressure on one gauge and the other they both read zero.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



mactube
User

Jul 11, 2020, 2:57 PM

Post #14 of 15 (82 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

may have been the gauges .. hat some trouble with them anyway I will have to get new ones to recheck.

I will up date here..


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Jul 11, 2020, 3:18 PM

Post #15 of 15 (77 views)
Re: Recharge / Evacuation - Oil Refill ? Sign In

I doubt it's the gauges themselves. Maybe the coupler or maybe you didn't have it connected properly or forgot to open the valve.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.







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