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95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!


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DamselInDistress
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Nov 27, 2013, 11:45 AM

Post #1 of 25 (1669 views)
  post locked   95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

HT I am so very sorry for seeming as if I blew you off after all your help!

Last week brought a great lead on a job (which I did get this past Monday), and I just had to take a hiatus from all this. But I had every intention of coming back here to let you know the verdict, oh....and to let you know that you were so on the right track with the voltage drop test!

I did take her to another mechanic out of desperation, another idiot....I just seem to attract that apparently. This guy found a code in the history which lead him to the Crankshaft Sensor. Since you, me, brother, and botched fuel pump job has all shown to be an issue with the fuel, that diagnosis really fried my brain!

Finally decided I needed to bring in brother (again) and ask what he though of that one. A few choice words among other things....lol.

I let him know that "this guy on the internet is really trying to help and the only other one who seems to know what he's talking about"....and through this conversation it came up that not only was the seal left off, but if only you could see the botched wiring job because the plug is different on the new plug.

That's when a light bulb went off and he asked "how it was done?" Me not having a clue as to wiring procedures in a car being any different, I just said "uh....only four wires Mike, all twisted together and color coded."

His response (again some choice words), go to the parts store and tell them you need butt connectors and a crimper. (Sigh) This is when I got a big lesson in "resistance" in a car's wiring. IT WAS causing a voltage drop which of course resulted in stalling.

Damn! Could kick myself for all this! (live and learn)

So the car was then running awesome, even took her on the Interstate....was just down to one more issue, that damn vent port on the pump not connecting anywhere really concerned me. It just didn't make sense that it vents "nowhere". (thank God for common sense)

I stopped into a dealership and asked them about it, of course they said it should connect to the venting system...but damned if I could find the hose. So I took it to the transmission shop who now knows me by first name. Lol They were willing to put it on the racks in their "free time" and see if they could find it for me. Took them a few days, but I assure you I am just grateful they were so gracious.

In summary, once the pump was actually sealed, the wiring actually connected properly (have no soldering gun or I would have used that), and the vent line runs into the system...we are finally GOOD!

I have learned my lesson in a big way, just wish I knew a "good" mechanic here. I have had three people who call themselves "mechanics" physically see this job and still scratch their heads. It took two mechanics (you and my brother) who never had that luxury to actually help me get it fixed. :(

If you know someone in the Kansas city area who is GOOD.....my car will be a regular there!!!

My car, my brother, and more than anything....I THANK YOU!!!!

Happy Thanksgiving! :)

[URL=http://s1288.photobucket.com/user/pjones19691/media/car1_zps9a77755d.jpg.html]

[URL=http://s1288.photobucket.com/user/pjones19691/media/car2_zps8f1881c6.jpg.html]


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Nov 27, 2013, 12:22 PM

Post #2 of 25 (1656 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

You are a sport kid. We call that "Wicked Pissa" (near Boston) and glad you've held on for the fix.

Hardest thing many times with car problems is DON'T GET MAD AT THE CAR! It doesn't care if you walk or ride and get used to that.

HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO YOU TOO.

Tom



DamselInDistress
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Nov 27, 2013, 12:32 PM

Post #3 of 25 (1650 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  


In Reply To
You are a sport kid. We call that "Wicked Pissa" (near Boston) and glad you've held on for the fix.

Hardest thing many times with car problems is DON'T GET MAD AT THE CAR! It doesn't care if you walk or ride and get used to that.

HAPPY THANKSGIVING TO YOU TOO.

Tom


Happy Thanks Giving to you Tom! :)

Definitely not mad at the car....more at myself! But "it's all good" her beautiful body is once again the center of attention on the road. Not that I am biased or anything. lol


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Nov 27, 2013, 12:51 PM

Post #4 of 25 (1645 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

Well, glad to hear you got it resolved. Wish you had mentioned those twisted wires a lot sooner. This guy must have been a complete moron. You just don't do things like that. You find a good shop through "word of mouth". Ask your friends, ask on Facebook, check Yelp, check Angies list.... all kinds of ways to find the right guy and once you find one, stick with him. Don't look for the lowest price because that is when you find the morons.

I'm going to put a link to this thread in your previous question. We try to keep the solutions with the questions for the benefit of other people reading this.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



DamselInDistress
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Nov 27, 2013, 1:05 PM

Post #5 of 25 (1638 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  


In Reply To
Well, glad to hear you got it resolved. Wish you had mentioned those twisted wires a lot sooner. This guy must have been a complete moron. You just don't do things like that. You find a good shop through "word of mouth". Ask your friends, ask on Facebook, check Yelp, check Angies list.... all kinds of ways to find the right guy and once you find one, stick with him. Don't look for the lowest price because that is when you find the morons.

I'm going to put a link to this thread in your previous question. We try to keep the solutions with the questions for the benefit of other people reading this.


Thanks HT....really wanted to post the solution for that very reason. MORON doesn't begin to describe him. Lol

Not a doubt in my mind you would have saved me from all this aggravation if I thought to mention it. I had no clue about "resistance" whatsoever or I assure you I would have!

Yes, next "mechanic" will involve no quotation marks if you know what I mean. Lol

Thanks again, and seriously feel free to take me up on my offer to help you with anything internet related, that's up my alley I assure you!

All the best and Happy Thanksgiving!!


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Nov 27, 2013, 1:20 PM

Post #6 of 25 (1633 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

I can't write any code but I'm pretty good with computers myself, at least as far as keeping them running. Appreciate the offer. I bet you're seeing some real lousy weather right about now. We are getting a deep freeze here for Thanksgiving tomorrow, Supposed to hit the 40s overnight. Sounds like a couch and football day tomorrow.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



DamselInDistress
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Nov 27, 2013, 4:43 PM

Post #7 of 25 (1624 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  


In Reply To
I can't write any code but I'm pretty good with computers myself, at least as far as keeping them running. Appreciate the offer. I bet you're seeing some real lousy weather right about now. We are getting a deep freeze here for Thanksgiving tomorrow, Supposed to hit the 40s overnight. Sounds like a couch and football day tomorrow.


You seemed like you would have it goin on in that area as well, very cool! :) No question Florida is a wee bit warmer (lmao), but it's been pretty damn cold here for a few days now. I think we may hit the 40's or tomorrow, sadly I think this is now appreciated. Unimpressed Warm enough to clean the garage and maybe just maybe start putting my truck back together. WoooHooo Will wait til the fumes die down and prove not to return for that one though! lol


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Nov 27, 2013, 5:36 PM

Post #8 of 25 (1622 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

An additional comment on your solution. Although butt connectors are far better than the twisting of wires that you had, it's not considered a good method in that environment. The pump actually should have come with some better butt connectors that heat shrink to keep the moisture out. What I would suggest now would be to pick up a small can of "liquid electrical tape"and use it to seal up the ends of the butt connectors to keep the moisture out.








.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Tom Greenleaf
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Nov 28, 2013, 2:12 AM

Post #9 of 25 (1616 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

Great stuff. Home centers and hardware stores have it now. Close cap quickly or lose whole container fast,

T



nickwarner
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Nov 28, 2013, 9:28 AM

Post #10 of 25 (1605 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  


In Reply To
We are getting a deep freeze here for Thanksgiving tomorrow, Supposed to hit the 40s overnight.


Really HT? You've gotten spoiled on that Florida weather. Was single digits a few nights this week when I left work. This keeps up and we'll be ice fishing in a few weeks.

DID: The reason the pump connector got changed was the factory plugs weren't too good at carrying the current. Had plenty of plugs get fried on them, and GM came out with a better one and had the pumps manufactured with it. So the new pumps you get at the parts house come with the pigtail you have to put in or the plug will not plug in. Sorry to say I've seen a few different cars like yours where people have done moron jobs on the wiring. Glad to see you're all fixed up now.


Hammer Time
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Nov 28, 2013, 10:04 AM

Post #11 of 25 (1603 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

It's improved a lot here now but still a little on the chilly side.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



DamselInDistress
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Nov 29, 2013, 8:31 AM

Post #12 of 25 (1591 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  


In Reply To
An additional comment on your solution. Although butt connectors are far better than the twisting of wires that you had, it's not considered a good method in that environment. The pump actually should have come with some better butt connectors that heat shrink to keep the moisture out. What I would suggest now would be to pick up a small can of "liquid electrical tape"and use it to seal up the ends of the butt connectors to keep the moisture out.








.


Have to go to Ace anyway, I will pick some of that up today! :)

Sooooo, have to let you know that I am 90% sure that when the tranny shop hooked up my vent line, it must have come unplugged from the other end. LMAO Really guys....CAN NOT make this stuff up!

I have been letting it "air out" since I got the car back the other day. (and not in no 66 degree weather HT, Cool) The fumes are back and I just don't understand it....that's the only thing that makes sense. But honestly, after this whole scenario....we are way past making sense! Ha

Any thoughts on where I can find the vent system to check this??? Cause, you know....it's the one part of my fuel system I have yet to master! Crazy


Hammer Time
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Nov 29, 2013, 8:39 AM

Post #13 of 25 (1587 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

That vapor line goes from the tank to the charcoal canister and another line goes from the canister to the engine. You could also have a line leaking somewhere and it only leaks when the engine is running to put it under pressure.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Tom Greenleaf
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Nov 29, 2013, 9:20 AM

Post #14 of 25 (1583 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

Just a note Damsel: That liquid tape stuff doesn't like cold so keep container warm at least. Of all dang things I have a critter that eats outdoor extension cords! Not sure what tastes so good about them? Am using that stuff and it works just slow - real slow to cure.

Eh - not comfortable with using heat to speed it up for near fuel anything, -- T

(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Nov 29, 2013, 9:22 AM)


DamselInDistress
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Nov 29, 2013, 10:26 AM

Post #15 of 25 (1571 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  


In Reply To
Just a note Damsel: That liquid tape stuff doesn't like cold so keep container warm at least. Of all dang things I have a critter that eats outdoor extension cords! Not sure what tastes so good about them? Am using that stuff and it works just slow - real slow to cure.

Eh - not comfortable with using heat to speed it up for near fuel anything, -- T


Thanks Tom, will make sure I use it with the car in the garage. :) Do I put it directly on the fitting where the wires run into the butt connectors?


Tom Greenleaf
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Nov 29, 2013, 10:38 AM

Post #16 of 25 (1568 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

With whatever connection so long as it's good just cover it. Brush is in cap. Ya - I've done some wire nut or just crimp garbage not for this important but would be exposed so covered it all sides.


It will behave quickly if you test it indoors over wax paper to see how it behaves. Cool for assorted repairs. If you test it inside on some stupid thing see how gasoline tolerant it is. Not much is but the early stuff was -- silicone sealants are NOT by surprise you think they are and NOT.

For me just a handy thing in general, fast helps. Tolerates extremes well,

T



Hammer Time
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Nov 29, 2013, 11:10 AM

Post #17 of 25 (1560 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

You're trying to seal off the part where the wire goes in so no moisture gets in.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



DamselInDistress
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Nov 29, 2013, 12:30 PM

Post #18 of 25 (1551 views)
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In Reply To
You're trying to seal off the part where the wire goes in so no moisture gets in.


Yup....totally with ya both on the liquid electrical tape. :) I am also trying to take care of this "venting problem" and have this job finished once and for all. Concept huh? lol

So I retract the vent tube being "the fume" problem, as I delved into the trunk once again....pretty sure it was a seal issue. I could feel some moisture which of course smells of gas. This is obviously on me since the first idiot never had one on there. So I googled sealants that were fuel resistant and came up with perminex.

Decided I really don't want to go into my trunk EVER again, so I pulled the pump out and found second o-ring dangling off the float inside the tank. Was almost a fishing expedition to get it out.

I can't imagine there should be two seals should there? There was the one on the brim which I put on, and somehow I guess he tried to seal God only knows what....which is why it appeared as if it was never sealed at all.

Good God the adventure never ends! Lol The good news is I believe this will take care of the fuel loss/fumes once and for all! I just want to triple check everything with you guys before I put it back together. :) Only 1 seal correct???

I currently have the one seal curing around the top brim of the pump where it will meet the trunk of the car to be secured. I planned on putting a layer of the sealant also around the trunk and other side of seal where the pump and trunk meet.....just to be extra sure it seals well. Am I on the right track here???

Please say yes Pam....you are! Wink


Hammer Time
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Nov 29, 2013, 1:04 PM

Post #19 of 25 (1546 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

Only one seal that fits into a groove and the lock plate compresses it. Make sure there's no dirt around it.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Nov 29, 2013, 1:06 PM)


DamselInDistress
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Nov 29, 2013, 1:26 PM

Post #20 of 25 (1541 views)
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In Reply To
Only one seal that fits into a groove and the lock plate compresses it. Make sure there's no dirt around it.



Got it. Everything is put back together...guess I should wait to make sure everything is good and dry before test driving??


Hammer Time
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Nov 29, 2013, 1:41 PM

Post #21 of 25 (1540 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

How come you're having to do all this stuff. Don't you have any kids or friends to do the dirty work?



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



DamselInDistress
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Nov 29, 2013, 2:00 PM

Post #22 of 25 (1535 views)
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In Reply To
How come you're having to do all this stuff. Don't you have any kids or friends to do the dirty work?


I know right!!! I have a 21 year old son....in Arizona!
In recovery here and sober for quite sometime, so I know several guys here and have tried my ass off to get someone to "step up" and help, they haven't for whatever reason.

At this point HT I give. It is as done as I am going to get it....hope and pray a lot, and take some peace knowing that by me getting in there today it wasn't half assed at least. :)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Nov 29, 2013, 3:38 PM

Post #23 of 25 (1534 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

Drive it a while. If the smell is persistent, then you can revisit the problem later.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



DamselInDistress
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Dec 1, 2013, 10:18 AM

Post #24 of 25 (1512 views)
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In Reply To
Drive it a while. If the smell is persistent, then you can revisit the problem later.


Thanks for all your help....re-sealing seems to have done the trick. :)


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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Dec 1, 2013, 10:30 AM

Post #25 of 25 (1510 views)
  post locked   Re: 95 Buick Riviera SOLUTION!!!  

OK, I think we can close this one now to keep the spammers out. Contact me or any other Mod by PM if you need it reopened.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.







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