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1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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chrisg7
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Jan 9, 2012, 2:07 PM
Post #1 of 12
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1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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This will be my first post on these forums, I hope that you all will be able to help me more than the mechanics I've dealt with recently 
So a few months ago I was at college and my mom was going to drive my car (1989 buick park avenue ultra ~160,000 miles) to get the yearly inspection. I was told that on the way to the inspection the vehicle started smoking and making some type of noise and the abs light came on. (i should probably note that i had been hearing a rattling noise when driving the vehicle before this) My mom took it to a mechanic who diagnosed it for around $100. He said that it would be around $500 to fix the problem. I did not want to pay that amount of money so i had the car driven back home and decided to deal with it when i got home from school.
A few weeks ago i got back for my winter break. I called the place that originally diagnosed it and they told me that they were sure that the ABS controller was broken, and that the hydraulic pump may also be broken, but i would need to replace the controller first. I ordered a new abs controller off eBay for $120 and got it installed by an auto electric shop for around $90. <-- this is weird because i did some research on the part and was told that it would be somewhere in the $200 range for labor, because some programing work needed to be done on the part, but the electric shop told me that no programming work needed to be done and they just needed to physically install it
After it was replaced, the shop told me that the ABS light was still on, so therefore the problem was not fixed. They said that cars like mine frequently have problems with the ABS pumps, but they would need to diagnose it (another $100!) to find out for sure. I asked them what other components the problem could possibly be and they would not give me a straight answer for some reason.
I would really like advice on what to do in this situation. I am willing to spend maybe $400 more max on this vehicle to get it running. I hope that one of you all can give me some more clear information than these mechanics. If the problem is something that i could fix by myself if i ordered the part, i would be more than happy to learn how to do that.
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Jan 9, 2012, 4:10 PM
Post #2 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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We aren't the ones inspecting the car. You have one shop diagnose it and then you think you can save a couple pennies and end up costing you even more. You are not qualified, nor equipped to diagnose a problem like this so you need to let the professional deal with it. You don't get to tell them how much you are going to spend. It is what it is and you will just have to deal with whatever the cost is if you plan on keeping the car.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jan 9, 2012, 5:56 PM
Post #4 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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I worry that mechanics are trying to rip me off and i would like to avoid that if possible. OH, that comment will get you a lot of help from mechanics donating their time.
I did read your post.
He said that it would be around $500 to fix the problem. I did not want to pay that amount of money so i had the car driven back home and decided to deal with it when i got home from school.
I am willing to spend maybe $400 more max on this vehicle to get it running.
As I told you, it takes some expensive equipment and considerable knowlege that would be utilized in an on site diagnosis. You figured you could buy the part cheaper and find someone to install it cheap. As you have found out now, that idea left you in worse shape than you started. You won't find a magic answer on any forum either because it requires diagnosis with a scan tool to determine what the cause it.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Jan 9, 2012, 5:58 PM)
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jan 9, 2012, 6:08 PM
Post #5 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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First thing you need to do is figure out what codes the ABS controller is storing to turn the light on. That's if the controller is up and running. Can't even begin to tell you what is wrong unless we have some numbers.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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chrisg7
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Jan 9, 2012, 6:18 PM
Post #6 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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I did read your post. Yeah my mistake man. I guess you did read my post but just didn't have the intelligence to decipher what i was saying. Let me try to explain to you again so you will hopefully understand. Originally one problem was diagnosed, a faulty abs controller. The mechanic told me once i fixed this there may or may not be more problems. He said he would charge around $500 to fix it. I instead got the part for $120 and got a mechanic who specialized in electrical components to install it for $90. ($120 + $90 = $210; $210 < $500 ) Turns out there were other problems. So, we can now determine that there were originally at least 2 problems with the entire abs assembly, one of which is now fixed. Because of this, i am in a better situation than i started out in but i still may have a long way to go. Hope that clarifies things for you! First thing you need to do is figure out what codes the ABS controller is storing to turn the light on. That's if the controller is up and running. Can't even begin to tell you what is wrong unless we have some numbers. So i'm guessing i need a special diagnostic device to do this? Thanks for the reply!
(This post was edited by chrisg7 on Jan 9, 2012, 6:21 PM)
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jan 9, 2012, 6:55 PM
Post #9 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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I'm going to tell you one thing. If that Powermaster hydraulic control assembly is bad, you might as well look for another car. You get into the thousands trying to fix that problem. How do you know the controller you bought off Ebay is any good? If you really want to keep the car, you could also convert it to regular vacuum brake booster and ditch the ABS.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Jan 9, 2012, 7:06 PM)
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chrisg7
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Jan 9, 2012, 7:07 PM
Post #10 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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The seller claimed that all parts were "100% tested and guaranteed to work" and had a good reputation on ebay...not sure how credible that is. I don't know if you can view the link but this is the part i bought
link deleted....not allowed
Could you explain how fixing the hydraulic assembly could get into the thousands? I got a quote for it off this site link deleted..., does it seem legitimate?
Thanks again for all of your help.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Jan 9, 2012, 7:26 PM)
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jan 9, 2012, 7:35 PM
Post #11 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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An experienced tech can determine if the controller is bad, the controller isn't getting inputs, the pump motor is shot, has faulty relays or pump switch, the hydraulic control is leaking, or the accumulator nitrogen has leaked out.
It seems like they are guessing to me. Not really that hard to diagnose which part(s) in that system are faulty. When I hear, "Well, we are not sure if this part is going to work unless you replace this one first." I get red flags. You just test each individual part like you would when diagnosing any problem on a vehicle to determine what is broken.
Testing the pump and checking for controller activity and operation isn't too difficult for most techs who know what they are doing.
You might want to have them energize the pump relay and see if the pump comes on before you go buying stuff you might not need. If the pump runs, check to see if the pressure switch circuit opens. You can also ohm out the switch to see if it has continuity when there is no pressure in the system. If the switch checks good but you have no pump operation, Unplug the pump motor connector and check for power and ground in the connector with the relay energized or bypassed. If the pump doesn't come on and you have power and ground to it, needs a pump. Mr. pump motor's power circuit is protected by a fusible link, so if the motor or wiring short to ground, or the motor pulls too many amps, it opens the link. It's important to make sure there is power in the relay cavity.
The controller side is a little more involved, but its circuits can be checked out using a wiring schematic and a DVOM.
Just a little hint:
If you look at the schematic for the pump motor, the controller has nothing to do with the operation of the pump motor anyway. Tell them that...LOL
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Jan 9, 2012, 8:05 PM)
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Discretesignals
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jan 9, 2012, 8:19 PM
Post #12 of 12
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Re: 1989 Buick Park Avenue ABS Problems
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I rebuilt a powermaster a long time ago working at the Buick dealer for a customer that had a GN. It was a $2000 ticket. I don't think you can get just the parts for the hydraulic control assembly alone anymore.
You can get a reman hydraulic control assembly, but because they are becoming scarce, they are expensive even with the core. You can also send it in for rebuild, but that is still over a thousand dollars. That doesn't include the labor cost of installation. If you get a used one off Ebay or the salvage yard, your chances of having problems is a whole lot greater.
Your not even sure if that is problem anyway. Needs to be diagnosed properly.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
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