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99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing


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sillysimms
User

Dec 1, 2007, 1:04 PM

Post #1 of 15 (1888 views)
99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

I brought my car, 1999 Honda Accord, in to a mechanic yesterday to have a power steering fluid leak fixed. They also changed the oil. At the mechanics, the odometer stopped displaying. As well, the speed, rpm etc. (the entire dashboard) is not working at all. At least I should say, the dashboard was displaying when I brought the car in but when I picked it up, the mechanic told me he noticed the kilometres were not showing and he checked some things and doesn't know why. I soon realized it's the whole dashboard display not working.

Please advise what could cause this. Could it have been something the mechanic might have done accidentally? Like loosen a wire or something, a quick fix? Or is it likely unrelated. The stereo was also asking for "code" when I picked the car up so it means the battery or alternator power supply had been disconnected. I don't have the code but can get it from my Honda dealer. That is less of a concern than the whole dash being out. I've replaced the battery today as the car is a '99 and had the original battery but still no fix. This is the first time in more than 8 years I took the car to anywhere besides Honda and am wondering if I made a mistake.

The mechanic says he didn't cause it but has no idea what is wrong with it and I should bring it to Honda. I've called them and made an appointment. I asked on the phone what it might be and he said he'll have to see it but most likely the instrument cluster has gone. Is this an expensive repair? Sounds like it. Is it possible the mechanic loosened a wire or something yesterday because it's odd that it happened at the same time the car was in the shop.

This is a 1999 Accord with under 60,000 kilometres. I don't drive it very much but have never had any problems with it and dread the thought of spending thousands on it. Any help is appreciated. Thank you.

(This post was edited by sillysimms on Dec 2, 2007, 4:18 PM)


sillysimms
User

Dec 2, 2007, 4:18 PM

Post #2 of 15 (1879 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

We have now found that when we drive the car it overheats.

Does the instrument panel not working and the car overheating point to any particular problem you can think of? Thank you.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Dec 2, 2007, 4:25 PM

Post #3 of 15 (1878 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

I'm not sure of this at all but I would be checking what the heck was in the way that might have been disturbed when fixing the PS leak. Didn't that mechanic suspect that since this happened exactly then?

Also, Is it really overheating or is that just what the gauge says? Do fans come on and does heat still blow heat when it reads hot?

T



sillysimms
User

Dec 2, 2007, 4:45 PM

Post #4 of 15 (1876 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

I think the mechanic noticed it but are not wanting to say it happened there. They said "when we changed the oil, we tried to take note of the kilometres but they aren't showing". I suspect they then may have unplugged the battery to see if it would reset, which is why the radio is asking for the anti theft security code.

I do feel we should have gotten the car back in the same condition we dropped it off in but they are telling us to take it to Honda. They said they checked some things when the odometer wasn't working but can't figure out what is wrong. I don't know much about cars but have heard different things eg. they may have shorted something out by hitting a wire with their wrench, may have shorted out the instrument panel by disconnecting or reconnecting the battery in the wrong order, might be a bad ground, maybe they forgot to reattach the cooling fan, may have left a wire disconnected, or the ECM may be shorted out.

Not sure, but will post when I find out. Haven't decided if we should take it to the dealer or take it back to the mechanic and ask that they fix it as the problem happened there.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Dec 3, 2007, 1:08 AM

Post #5 of 15 (1873 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

It sounds like they noticed this and may have checked it out before you picked up the car and didn't find the problem. What was fixed with the PS? I'd just glance at the area. There may be a high pressure sensor in the PS high hose or perhaps on the rack to tell the engine to cover the load so you don't stall - otherwise it isn't all that involved with electronics of the car.

If this took lots of work to fix the leak for some reason and items needed to be moved just check what would have been moved. If somehow the ECM got shorted it really could have taken it out.

I doubt changing the oil had anything to do with it but look around the oil filter or air filter for wiring.

There would also be a ground strap that I find myself mentioning all the time that grounds the negative (ground) of the engine to the body and perhaps one just for the dash itself. This car still runs which is a good sign.

You were VERY late in replacing the original battery but that probably was no issue as the car still started after all this. Know that a good battery is more important than ever in cars. You really should be on a schedule to just replace them IMO between 3-4 years and use a memory saver available almost anywhere. Until further notice I use a 9v battery to a thing that goes in a power port or cigarette lighter that would be always empowered when disconnecting the battery for any reason. So far that has always worked.

Stuff happens and trust me that nobody is pleased by this. I would take it back to the shop and let them try again or let them set you up with a dealer or place they would use. I don't know of a shop or dealer that does every aspect of auto repair but they should have contacts with other shops that specialize. If this was a real odd-ball car that would be different but certainly not the case with an Accord.

Sorry for the book: One last thing...... Don't let this car overheat. That can only add insult to injury at this point,

T



sillysimms
User

Dec 3, 2007, 1:47 PM

Post #6 of 15 (1866 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Thanks for the response. Yes, they did notice and tried to fix and told us they couldn't figure out what was the problem and we needed to take it to Honda. The mechanic also said that when we entered the code for the radio, the odometer would likely work again which is not true at all. Today my husband called to talk to them about it and they didn't call him back so he went down to the shop. The mechanic says he thinks the car was like that when we dropped it off as he's as confused about it as we are. Now this is definitely a problem because I 100% guarantee the car was NOT like that when dropped off.

The repair on the power steering was replacing and clamping the hose. I am aware now that a battery generally has a life of about 5 years, but I did not know this before. I don't know much about the mechanics of cars. This is the first time since I bought it I took it to anyone but Honda for service and hoping that wasn't a big mistake. I've taken it there for each scheduled maintenance and they never suggesting replacing the battery. It was last in 3 months ago. I just thought that because the car was rarely driven and had very low kilometres and the battery was working fine, it didn't need replacement and it was never suggested to me by the dealer to replace it. This weekend I've read that they generally have a max. life of about 3 years.

We had it towed to Honda today to make sure it doesn't overheat. The dashboard lights work but the controls don't, so you can't tell when it is getting hot. I've told them the whole story and they're looking at it. They said sometimes it is impossible to tell what caused a problem to happen so we might not know if it was a coincidence or not. I'm thinking this will be very expensive. Just to get started the fee is $95 to diagnose the dashboard problem PLUS another $95 to diagnose the overheating issue.

Will update when I get more info as I'm awaiting their call.


sillysimms
User

Dec 3, 2007, 7:36 PM

Post #7 of 15 (1861 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

They've called. They have said the circuit board on the instrument panel has gone and needs to have the entire instrument panel/instrument gauges replaced. They don't know why it would happen in a car with under 60K but can't say the mechanic did something, they thing it's random. I think it's odd that it happened while it was at the mechanics, but there's nothing I can do about it.

Regarding the overheating, they asked if I took the radiator cap off. My husband did after the engine cooled down to check the fluid levels. They said we should never take it off as it is dangerous. Then we realized they thought were had been driving with it off so we confirmed that we did not drive with the cap off. They said they noticed fluids in the engine but they drove it for a while and it didn't overheat. The fluids likely got there when the car overheated. I told them the displays on the dash weren't working so my husband couldn't tell it was overheating until it was already hot. They wanted to know how he knew it was overheating without the displays on the dash working so my husband said that steam had started coming out of the hood. He stopped the car and after it had cooled down for some time, he took off the radiator cap to check the fluid level. They can't figure out why it was overheating as it didn't happen today but they'll have the car for another 3 days waiting for the instrument panel and will drive it more

The bill so far:

$95 to diagnose the instrument panel problem
$95 to diagnose the overheating problem (even though no solution found, we're still being charge)
$201 for the instrument panel
$144 for the labour

They said if they can find out anything about the overheating they'll call and advise how much that fix will cost.

Do you think it would be useful to ask to have the old instrument panel
back when they replace it? We're allowed to request return of parts
that are replaced in our province. Wondering if looking at it would
shed any light on what happened? Should I request the old instrument
panel or would it just be a waste of time?


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Dec 4, 2007, 2:55 AM

Post #8 of 15 (1858 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

This could be a coincidence but I still can't link the dash and the overheating together except for perhaps the fans don't come on as they may not get the info from the car that it's hot enough for them to operate.

Where are you? I don't really need to know except for the climate you are dealing with right now. Why can't they diagnose the overheating right now? THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE! This engine runs and that's enough to check out the cooling system. Scary because you did seem to really overheat enough to cause problems which is yet to be known.

Do you trust the folks you are dealing with? Stuff does happen and has happened to me that even defied chances.

Do keep your old parts. If nothing else you have them if they replace something that wasn't the problem those may be good. I still don't get it why they can't figure out the overheating. That just must be the lack of fan(s) as the thermostat and water pump are not electronically controlled at all!

T



sillysimms
User

Dec 4, 2007, 4:05 PM

Post #9 of 15 (1855 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Thanks. I will keep the old parts then, it can't hurt. The car didn't overheat today either I've been told.

Unfortunately my husband and I aren't that mechanically inclined. What he is wondering is this - he didn't know the car was overheating because the gauge wasn't working at all. He only knew something was wrong after steam started coming out of the engine. After the car cooled down, he looked under the hood and the radiator cap didn't feel that it was on that tightly, so he checked the fluid level and then tightened it up.

Would overheating cause the radiator cap to come loose OR could the fact that the radiator cap wasn't tight cause all the steam to come out from the hood while driving? Not sure, but it's just a guess. Maybe the car wasn't overheating. He's just thinking it was because of all the steam, but without the gauge, we don't know. I'm not sure if radiator caps can just become loose over time and this unfortunately happened at the same time or it could have been loosened during whatever repairs were done? The dealer said it hasn't overheated but there were fluids in the engine and they had asked if we'd driven with the cap off (which we hadn't, but maybe it wasn't tight?).

As for trusting the people we're dealing with, I have been taking my car there since I bought it. Of course, being the dealer, I do think they charge more than other places, but at this point, I don't know who I would prefer to take it to since we've had either really bad luck or an incident occur at the other shop now.

We're in Toronto Ontario so the temperature here right now is about -5 Celsius (23 F).

Thanks for your help.


sillysimms
User

Dec 4, 2007, 5:00 PM

Post #10 of 15 (1852 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Update: I just called and Honda and asked for the part to be returned. They said fine but they'll have to call me tomorrow and let me know if there's a "core charge". Hadn't heard about this as in Ontario a law had been passed saying you can get your old parts back when a repair is done, but the dealership has just told me some parts can be rebuilt and if this is the case, they'll charge a "core charge" if I want the old part back. They'll let me know tomorrow, but I'm guessing they're likely to tell me there will be a charge if I want it.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Dec 4, 2007, 5:13 PM

Post #11 of 15 (1851 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

If the rad cap was left loose then coolant would have spilled out normally and made steam from just some splatters on hot parts of the engine. It may NOT have overheated. At the temps you are in - similar to here - you would have had heat on and that alone if you were moving is also cooling the engine. If engine did get so hot as to boil then the heater will quit blowing warm/hot air for you as it takes liquid to transfer the heat. You found it still full so it was probably left loose. Overheating would not loosen the cap by itself. It's just a sealed cap with sprung seal to allow pressure to build up as engine warms and when pressure exceeds the set # is passes on to the recovery tank to be drawn back when it cools down again.

Some parts if used do impose a "core" charge for that one to be rebuilt and sold again. AutoZone here is doing that with even new parts and I've argued with them about that as I'm buying NEW and why should I even have to have an old one --- dammit I could have just wanted an ornament?? That's not a law here but just the store policy.

If there is a core and you want to keep it you could keep it for a while and ask if you can return it later. There could be sales tax that wouldn't be returned so you'd have to ask.

At the moment I don't think you really overheated so that's good news! Let me know how it works out,

T



sillysimms
User

Dec 5, 2007, 2:24 PM

Post #12 of 15 (1844 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Well, the good news is the car is fixed. You don't realize how much you need a car until you're without one for a period of time! My husband will either drop me off to pick it up tonight or the dealership will send their courtesy vehicle tomorrow to get me.

I just should make one clarification, as I just found out. There was a slight misunderstanding I think. When they called they told me the circuit board on the instrument panel was gone and the whole thing needed to be replaced. I guess I interpreted that to mean they were replacing the whole instrument panel. I'd called yesterday and asked for return of the part. The message they left me today was that it's fixed, there is no core charge on the circuit board so they've left it in the car. I guess that would mean only the circuit board and not the whole instrument panel was replaced.

They seemed to try to be fair although I hadn't taken it there for the original repair. They said they've deducted an hour of labour to help offset the overheating diagnosis charge as they didn't find anything. So the cost came to just under $500/total including taxes.

So as of tomorrow I should have a car again.

I really thank you for your help. At least I got to learn a (little!) bit more about the mechanics of cars throughout this. Hopefully we won't have any more problems. Thanks again, for your help, very much appreciated.


sillysimms
User

Dec 5, 2007, 9:56 PM

Post #13 of 15 (1840 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Picked up the car. Everything is almost back to normal. The km's are reset to 0 and there's a sticker in the door to show what they were at before the switch. I did get the old circuit board back. I don't think I'd be able to figure out what happened by looking at it.

The only thing I don't like after the replace is that now on the dash when you change from park to drive etc. the lights on the dash don't change like they used to. There are green lights around PRND etc. and they stay there all the time, don't change when I shift from Park to Drive etc. as they used to, to tell me what gear I'm in. Unfortunately, I guess I'll have to live with that. Glad to have the car back.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Dec 6, 2007, 1:16 AM

Post #14 of 15 (1838 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Do keep track of the odometer change as with low mileage that plays a big role in the car's value. Bet the lighting for the gear selector is just a thin black band of plastic that is supposed to slide to cover the light in all but where it is and may be pulled by like a fishing line type string. Been there in some other make vehciles. You decide on whether you want them to dig back into that - it might be a simple hook up with a clip and string - don't know for sure.

At any rate it seems that the nightmare is over for the most part. I have one going on right now with total success and back to the failure within six hours that has eluded the best of the best help I can find. Intermittent electrical junk with hard to get at parts that are the likely fault - arggh!

Happy Holidays,

T



sillysimms
User

Dec 7, 2007, 1:18 AM

Post #15 of 15 (1831 views)
Re: 99 Accord - overheating, dashboard (mileage, rpm, speed) not showing Sign In

Thanks. Good advice. I was thinking about it last night and the only reason the gears are on the dash is so you can see what gear you're in. It was working before this "big mess" (that what I've nicknamed this whole situation!) I've made an appointment and am bringing it in next week.

I'm sure you'll solve the problem you're working on too. You've been a great help.

Happy holidays to you as well.






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