|
|
2001 windstar start issues
|
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 17, 2013, 12:21 PM
Post #1 of 22
(1758 views)
|
|
2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
2001
Ford
Windstar
V6
180000 miles
Hi,
Just the facts...
Busted rear window last fall. Set alarm off, pulled horn relay to silence and parked in garage. Recently decided to address. Charged battery (no problem), car cranked but did not get gas (would ignite starter fluid). Mechanic said fuel pump needed replaced (reset button did not need reset). Replaced fuel pump and drove home no problems. 2 days later went to start and battery dead. Hooked up jumper cables and horn starts honking and lights flashing (evidently mechanic replaced relay). Pulled horn relay and went to jump. Headlights flickering very dim and clicking noise coming from inside (wheelchair lock buzzing and acting strange). Connected charger... Amp meter on charger high and vibrating. Lights and clicking noises still. When connecting charger a volt meter shows about 11v but drops while charger still attached.
Puzzled
Tibber
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 17, 2013, 12:41 PM
Post #2 of 22
(1747 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Pulling the horn relay m,ay have silenced the alarm but it didn't shut it off. You need to have that alarm removed.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 17, 2013, 12:42 PM
Post #3 of 22
(1746 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Sounds like battery is toast now and setting off alarm. You can't really just let a battery sit for that long probably dead and expect it to be any good later and surprised it took a charge in the first place,
T
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 17, 2013, 1:03 PM
Post #4 of 22
(1730 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Hadn't considered that. Battery about 2 yrs old.
It's a PATS alarm system. Can that be disabled?
|
|
| |
|
|
Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 17, 2013, 1:05 PM
Post #5 of 22
(1728 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
It's been sitting. Brand new they toss batteries at a year or less if unsold!
T
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 17, 2013, 2:35 PM
Post #6 of 22
(1711 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
No, Pats isn't associated with the horn. You have something else added.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 17, 2013, 2:42 PM
Post #7 of 22
(1710 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
One other tidbit... just talked to the mechanic. They had the van for full week before trying to start it and had no problems cranking. I had it for 2 days with the horn relay plugged in.
Is it kind of strange though that the alarm wasn't going off when they plugged the relay in and all during the two days I had it before it showed up doa?
Not sure if it's the relay/horn/anti-thieft or something else but something seems to be draining the battery since I got it back. Before I replace the battery I'm thinking of disconnecting it and charging it up then trying so see what the draw is with "nothing" turned on.
Thanks!
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 17, 2013, 3:28 PM
Post #8 of 22
(1701 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Here's how it's done....................
You will need a digital ammeter and a jumper wire with clips on the ends to do this.
First rig any door switches so you can have a door open without triggering the interior lights and unplug the hood light. Remove one battery cable and attach the meter in series between the battery cable and battery post. Take the jumper wire and also attach it the same way. Leave the jumper wire on for at least 10 minutes to expire all the automatic timers. Now remove the jumper wire and read the meter. Anything over 50ma is too much draw. The way you locate this is to start removing fuses one at a time until the meter drops to normal level. This will be the circuit with something staying on. Determine what components are part of that circuit and check them individually until the problem is isolated.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 17, 2013, 5:36 PM
Post #9 of 22
(1694 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Thanks for the value.... that's what I needed
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 12:44 PM
Post #10 of 22
(1675 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Ok... I feel like I'm making progress....
Charged it up. Went to check initial current draw before getting all setup as Hammer Time suggested. On the 10A range (my max), in the short term it was bouncing between 15A and up. While doing this I noticed the clicking noise was in time with the now fully energized headlights flashing on and off (if the horn relay was in I'm sure it would join the chorus). This makes me feel like it's the alarm going off because I have no back window.
Agree or Disagree?
If agree I guess the question is ( if anti theft cannot be bypassed or disabled ) can I drive to the glass shop to get the window replaced and will this stop all the madness? It did start right up even though PATS is supposed to disable the starter as I understand it. Maybe using a proper key allows this?
That's where I'm at 
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 18, 2013, 12:56 PM
Post #11 of 22
(1674 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
That makes no sense at all. First off, if you had that meter hooked up right, 15A would have fried it. You shouldn't even be running that much current through the meter. That's what the instruction said to use a jumper wire until everything went to sleep.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 3:01 PM
Post #12 of 22
(1667 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Ok... sorry bout that....
Looks like the big draw is the A/C Compressor Clutch. You can hear it clunk when you connect the battery or replace the fuse. Looks like about a 3A difference when the fuse is in. I do recall that I had to play with the controls on the way home from the shop just to get the A/C to come on. I guess that might be the difference of it staying up a week at the shop then only lasting a day or two when I got it home.
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 18, 2013, 3:04 PM
Post #13 of 22
(1666 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
AC Compressor?????
How can that be on if everything is powered off?
Are you saying the compressor is staying energized when the keys are out of the ignition?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 3:07 PM
Post #14 of 22
(1664 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
According to my fuse map (#3) and the location of the sound of the clunk. Stuck relay maybe?
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 3:08 PM
Post #15 of 22
(1662 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
and yep.... the key was on top of the dash
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 18, 2013, 3:09 PM
Post #16 of 22
(1662 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
You need to be much more clear on what you are doing and finding.
Are you saying that this clutch is engaged when the key is out of the ignition?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 18, 2013, 3:12 PM
Post #17 of 22
(1660 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
OK, you got in while I was posting. Try removing the AC compressor relay and swapping it with another like relay such as the horn and see what happens.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Sep 18, 2013, 3:14 PM)
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 3:17 PM
Post #18 of 22
(1658 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Every time I've connected the charged battery or connected jumper cables or charger, with the key out of the ignition, I've heard the clunk.
I did all troubleshooting with the key out of the ignition.
When I pulled Fuse #3 (A/C Compressor Clutch) the current fell to the lowest reading (and only significant difference) I ever saw of pulling all of the fuses in both boxes. It was a difference of around 3A
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 3:44 PM
Post #19 of 22
(1655 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Amazing.... Here's a photo of the A/C Relay. The piece of plastic matches a hole in the top of the case where maybe a puller might have missed the mark and poked through??
I've been grumbling the last few days how I wish I had a puller. Yesterday the mechanic said they checked relays to trouble shoot the fuel pump problem.... just sayin'
Horn relay works great in A/C slot. I can turn it on and off at will.
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 18, 2013, 4:26 PM
Post #20 of 22
(1651 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
And i assume when you plug that relay into the horn slot, the horn goes off constantly.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
|
Tibber
User
Sep 18, 2013, 5:53 PM
Post #21 of 22
(1637 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
Well.... before I dissected it I put it back in the A/C socket and it always kicked on the clutch, totally opposite from what the other relay did. I've removed the piece of plastic and the relay moves freely. I suppose once I replace the glass and don't have to worry about the horn disturbing the peace I'll plug it in.
Thanks for hanging in there. I appreciate the help.
BTW I never could figure out how where the heck the door switch was. Checked the door and frame on both doors. Maybe a magnetic switch hidden away?
|
|
| |
|
|
Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
/ Moderator
Sep 18, 2013, 5:59 PM
Post #22 of 22
(1636 views)
|
|
Re: 2001 windstar start issues
|
Sign In
|
|
The door switches are built into the latches, inside the door.
Just pick up a new relay for the horn or put the original back in the horn slot and the new one in the AC. Just throw that broken one away.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
|
|
| |
|
Auto Repair Home
SEARCH
WHO'S 
LOG 
2011 Dodge Nitro OBD scanner seems to drain battery in 10-20 minutes
Grounding Cable, 2017 Jeep Renegade Trailhawk
equipment
Howdy
