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1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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ba_50
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Jan 25, 2016, 8:29 AM
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1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I've got a 1985 Ford ltd mid-size wagon with 54000 miles on a V6. When I take out the left rear bulb it doesn't blow a fuse but when it is in, it blows the fuse. There is a black box in the fender behind the bulb section. It looks like the wires might go up and across the top of the window. What should I do next? If I can't repair it, I've seen where you can run a wire from a new light to the fuse box but can't find the article. It would be better to fix it of course. Thank you.
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Tom Greenleaf
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Jan 25, 2016, 8:58 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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! This should be easy IMO. Have you plain looked hard inside and back side of the socket? That or tried another bulb almost certain it's an 1157 dual filament bulb. Verify that at parts outlet. Some people will force an 1156 in it and blow fuses.
If it can blow a fuse power and ground are making it to the socket. At this age no telling, may need to spice in a new socket and should still be available just do the splicing properly - solder and shrink tubing over the repair. Lube sockets with bulb lube or dialectic grease anytime you are near them or checking them.
OK: New socket may come with all the same or wrong color wires from the car. You'll need to know with a test light which one goes where if so.
OK to me to just use wire nuts for test that this works then do the right splicing.
Remember it's the brake light, turn signal and running/parking light in one or maybe more bulbs of the same in that lens?
 Smile, you must be one of very few people to still have one of these cars. It's a Fairmont in disguise, unit body and folks rejected the smaller size so Ford kept making the larger car,
T
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ba_50
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Jan 25, 2016, 9:41 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I forgot to mention that the rear bulbs and speedometer lights go out. A lot of engine parts have replaced yet nobody seems interested in buying it. Glad to hear you think it is a good car. It doesn't ride well, especially going 1400 miles. It doesn't have any rust to speak of on the exterior metal. I de-rusted the rusty parts and used that expensive primer on it. Most people don't want these old cars. I hesitate to sell it though. It sure has a lot of get up and go to it. The most I've been offered is $1000. Book on it is around $2200 in good condition.
A mechanic put in a couple of new switches or something, (I will look it up on the receipt), but didn't solve the problem. Charged a bunch too.
I'll check the bulb area when I get home. Thanks
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Tom Greenleaf
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Jan 25, 2016, 10:14 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Old phart here. They used to put fuse on dash light and brake lights on same fuse so you would know brake lights weren't working for ages before this car. I don't know this or it's sister car the Marquis not Grand Marquis are similar/same really.
Reason I'm near sure these didn't sell well is Ford did in fact change their mind and keep the larger car by that nameplate then called them Crown Victoria and Grand Marquis.
Nothing wrong I know of by design just didn't turn out to sell well. Many don't and you see them bought up by rental car companies sometimes.
Back to the problem. It's so clear if not misunderstood by me that just taking a bulb OUT stops the problem smacks that the problem is right there. Check all while there as said and grease them up. If other bulbs mess up just removing them and might you may need to do more of them.
OK - these sockets and bulbs are used in many cars this old and older still on the road in some places and almost universal fit so shouldn't be hard at all.
Just checked - still available new as I thought.........
 Price: $17.99
In Stock
***************************************
Bulbs as I thought too............
Those you can find anywhere in stock and it might be just the metal of the bulb not the socket?
If this work isn't for you my guess is just about a while you wait repair at a decent shop and be on your way,
T
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ba_50
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Jan 26, 2016, 10:13 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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The socket looks very clean, no rust, and looks like the one in your picture. I used an 1157 bulb from the other side which also blew the fuse. What is the black box the wires go into? Could something be corroded in it? Couldn't it be a wire? I don't see how a wire could have been damaged as they appear to run inside the panels instead of under the frame. There isn't any ground wire showing which might need cleaning.
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Tom Greenleaf
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Jan 26, 2016, 11:17 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Problem is more THAT socket as you tested it with another bulb. Forget wires to the front they are empowered to the socket but by putting a bulb in there crosses power to ground so ground works by default but still may share a ground to body back there to clean and check just because.
The sockets can fail unseen or on back side. The two nubs the bulbs touch on round typed are spring loaded to maintain contact and spring itself could have busted shorting out when bulb is put in?
The bulbs listed were and still are all over the place for trailers so not obsolete. Boat trailers (owned many) especially a high problem spot as they (who the heck designed some of those?) aren't water tight and launching a boat frequently dunks whole assembly so if not totally greased about annually they are a constant problem.
Yes - you can replace just one wire and spring on some from another but forget that - too much hassle. For the car the socket should also seal against lens to keep moisture out and that seal can't be good still and comes with new socket. It could be good or trashed too but located where it doesn't get wet?
OK - So some tools to check would really just be a soldering iron, test light, wire stripper/cutter, solder of course, shrink tube or at least liquid electrical tape. If you don't have any of this and aren't going to use this type stuff just have this done as said.
It's my experience that U-Haul places are quite well equipped for this stuff with all their trailers and wiring jobs to vehicles including hitches at many.
If you just plain want to do this go for it. You could if available get all the sockets and fuses you need at a pick your own salvage yard not even if from a Ford at all probably and fill a cup with fuses as most places (here) aren't going to do that when they squish the wrecks so give them to you.
Doubt it but if the socket is very vehicle specific you may have to go new. I haven't even seen one of these in probably 20+ years even in junk yards now that metal is worth bucks older stuff is just taking up space for something that would have wanted parts that sell enough.
Up to you. Almost any shop you like this should be no problem. IDK - perhaps stop by one if you wish and see if they would like YOU to get the parts or let them being this old the socket might not be a stock item but later in day part or next day?
Hey - If enough trouble I probably have a box full of all this in my dusty shop right now. It's not worth the postage to send stuff to you.
Again - this is easy stuff as things go but you really need them to work. If this confuses anyone that calls themself a tech or mechanic go somewhere else,
T
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ba_50
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Jan 26, 2016, 11:30 AM
Post #7 of 24
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I see what you are saying. The number you supplied helped me find a socket for about $12 shipped. Cheap fix if it works. I have everything except the shrink wrap. Thanks. Bob
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Tom Greenleaf
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Jan 26, 2016, 11:53 AM
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Generic stuff: Hardware, auto parts stores, Home Centers for wiring stuff. Socket by mail was probably a waste of time but popular and a few bucks less. If wrong one makes its own hassle. I'm not a great fan of mail order vs part in hand matched up for much but up to you of course and always is.
Forgot one tool for heat shrink wrap: Heat gun but a careful job with a lighter or even hair dryer would do.
When I say this isn't hard it isn't to anyone who deals with this all the time or just some. First times at much of anything takes a bit longer usually.
Knowing who or where to get dinky stuff like the shrink tubing isn't really a web thing. Radio Shack - all the places already mentioned too.
Again - if this gives you a hassle hit back up to PM me but said for me postage would exceed all costs,
T
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ba_50
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Jan 30, 2016, 1:18 PM
Post #9 of 24
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I noticed the left blinker wasn't working so I replace both bulbs and it started working. I tried the headlights several times with the motor off and it didn't blow the fuse. Yet after I started the engine, then turned on the lights it promptly blew a fuse.
I told a local mechanic that someone wired it wrong. A multi-function and headlight switch was put in. Is there some way I could check them?
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Tom Greenleaf
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Jan 30, 2016, 2:55 PM
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It's possible that the short the blows a fuse isn't right there but highly unlikely since it requires you putting a bulb in it right there. The color of the whole socket could be black and wires different colors but work on a new one.
The socket may look fine but you'll notice the nubs that touch nubs of the bulb in the socket are spring loaded. Unseen if a spring (metal) broke and touched wrong it would blow a fuse.
This could have been fixed before poorly with just electrical tape long gone and just pushing a bulb it the wires to that socket touch ground when power is sent and same thing - blow the fuse as it should with a short.
This is so far from any rocket science it's nuts. Any tech worth their salt would have this done before you could finish a soda waiting.
The common denominator you kept saying is it takes a bulb put in that socket to cause a problem. It just doesn't make sense that a "multifunction" switch would care or know if a bulb was there or not.
Granted there are some crazy reasons it's not this and my guess is wrong but doubt that totally,
Tom
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ba_50
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Feb 6, 2016, 9:05 AM
Post #11 of 24
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I put in an auto zone socket and it blew a 20A fuse right away. The only other thing back there is a black box behind the light.
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 6, 2016, 9:27 AM
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? - ! - ?
Hmmm. Black box - are wires going thru that? Did this ever have a trailer hitch and lighting wired to it?
One more and doubt it but maybe off on wrong tangent if this thing has amber turn signals AND red only brake lights and was first year for the 3rd or high mount brake light those took a box to make a trailer lighting work which is 99.9% plain red turn and brake lights.
This should have been a no brainer and turned not so - sorry. Now I'm betting that at some time a trailer was wired now that is the problem and reason for this black box thing you mentioned which makes no sense to me as sockets and bulb parts listing was for red only on this when you see the dual filament bulbs and matching dual contacts for the bulb.
If you put a back up light bulb in those they will cause problems or if anyone ever did. Problem wouldn't heal but harm something and thinking of where to look?
------------------------------------
One more that I'm pretty sure isn't involve but do check as it's easy. Look at wires to brake light switch higher up on brake pedal. Some totally other models with same switch there had short wires such that if brake pedal went low they could pull out but again makes no sense as this is picking on one bulb and socket?
Check on that box thing for markings. Might even say "U-Haul" on it if what I'm thinking,
Tom
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ba_50
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Feb 6, 2016, 9:48 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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There is no indication of trailer lighting or hitch. The front turn signals (covers) are amber, not the back.
(This post was edited by ba_50 on Feb 6, 2016, 10:19 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 6, 2016, 10:02 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Fronts have to be amber - rears only for some usually other countries.
It's now about that box you mentioned. See, if power get to the socket and then shorts out with now new socket and known bulb it has to be sending current to ground from there so ask where? One would be sending current on to a trailer lighting plug that doesn't usually need a box for all red rears that you have for a plain 4 wire trailer. Car isn't rated to haul much more like something with electric brakes or something more - can't say someone didn't try?
Question now is what's with that box? Do wires go to socket from the thing or how is that involved - guess as the car is rare but not unlike other vehicles Ford made that I know of and wouldn't really know as there weren't that many that came my way and any were new at the time as they were wildly inexpensive because they weren't selling well,
T
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ba_50
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Feb 6, 2016, 10:22 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I looked for a ground wire and couldn't find any. Just the 3 going to the socket and 2 going to the tailgate light switch. How am I supposed to check if power is shorting out at the socket? Don't understand.
(This post was edited by ba_50 on Feb 6, 2016, 10:26 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 6, 2016, 11:49 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Taillight switch is just an "on/off" switch.
Socket again:
OK - One wire is for bright light filament which is brake or turn signal other is for called both parking or running light filament. Bulb has two nubs and socket is made such that a nub is deeper than the other so it can only go in one way if not forced and you could.
Therefore - if power arrives bulb in there or not and not blowing fuse for the brake or turn but not just running it would show power getting to socket since it can blow a fuse strongly suggests that the power sent somehow by the bulb's presence is being grounded directly not just passing thru and lighting the lamp. That's why it was suspect. Under those nubs now new they are sprig loaded with a metal spring if corroded could shoot raw voltage to dead ground inside and unseen which would blow a fuse and should if faulty.
Sorry for the book on something so primal really. I don't understand why new socket and new bulb or one that works elsewhere could be right with ONLY the bulb being installed the common reason for blowing the fuse? That is messing with my head!
This is why I suspected trailer wiring. Power could be sent and hacked into and on to also power a wire for a trailer but even so doesn't add up that it would care about the bulb being there or not would still blow the fuse. DID I MISUNDERSTAND THAT?
PLEASE TELL ME AND IF SO WE NEED TO CHANGE COURSE ON WHERE IT'S SHORTING OUT POWER ENOUGH TO BLOW A 20AMP FUSE! IF IT BLEW EVERY TIME YOU TOUCHED THE BRAKE OR TURN SIGNAL IT WOULD BE ANOTHER CHASE FOR WHY.
If so far I'm right just for the check pull the flasher out and leave it out. There should be two of the same, one for the hazards one for the directionals - know which one or pull both out.
There's a clue missing in this so far - sorry,
T
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ba_50
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Feb 8, 2016, 1:51 PM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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 I tried to post photos using snap fish but it didn't work. It says your photo upload is free yet it talks about pricing in the terms?
Anyhow, the black box is a first inertia switch made in England with the Ford name on it. It looks like two red wires run along the tail gate, over behind the right signal and towards the front of the car. A wire or wires goes over next to the wheel well too. I believe it has something to do with the fuel pump.
Bob
(This post was edited by ba_50 on Feb 8, 2016, 2:39 PM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 8, 2016, 3:44 PM
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Correct - the inertia switches just disable the fuel pump with a red button to push if set off by mistake somehow. That has NOTHING to do with lighting.
Back to the light. If (you need to clear this up if I'm wrong) you say it will NOT blow a fuse without a bulb and does WITH a bulb I can't think of why not unless some freaking reason wrong bulbs have somehow wrecked two sockets the same way - a near impossible thing.
You should be able to just poke a test light with bulb out in the socket carefully not to let probe touch sides inside it to the button on the bottom and one will light the test light with running lights AKA parking lights the other with brake light or directional which are the same filament brighter than the plain running light. On directional your test light would blink.
Harder to do so could use a long jumper wire to power or even jumper cables not hooked up to anything just power a test light's alligator clip then what it touches is ground. The sidewalls of the socket are supposed to be ground and test light would light using it backwards if you get me.
This basic type - different handles and colors but like a scratch awl with a wire and clip then handle lights up. $5-10 bucks @ Walmarts, NAPA isn't expensive either for just that should be all you need and check out double ended jumper wires ready to go or make some if you wish.
Back powered by anything with power I just know it far from the car's battery and don't want you tapping into some other source for testing purposes.
Good grief buddy - you must be going more nuts than I am and blowing fuses like crazy testing this. Hope you could get a can full at a junkyard as the stupid things in packs get expensive,
T
(pics are a pest at this site! Try photobucket or Google Images of common things)
Test light........
Your inertia switch.........
^^^^ May not show or look different than yours,
Pics can disappear here or a box with an "X" if they either expired or not allowed for some reason?
(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Feb 8, 2016, 3:54 PM)
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ba_50
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Feb 9, 2016, 12:09 PM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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I can check it again but believe that's right. Not sure I'm clear on the test. Put one probe on bottom button and the inside each wire socket? Then move the signal lever? I get tired of spending money on cars and nothing working. The mechanic charged pretty good money and didn't fix it. I wrote to him and no reply. 1400 miles away.
(This post was edited by ba_50 on Feb 9, 2016, 12:36 PM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 9, 2016, 2:27 PM
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OK - I'm looking for videos and pics if they'll show how simple this is. This is just a link to a test light being used. That's a more expensive one than you would need but shows primal basics of what one is. Clip could be alligator type or other as shown - doesn't matter. No joke - this isn't even auto mechanics you can test a 9V household battery with these!
Click on the link and do test your test light that it works on the car's battery as this guy is doing............
Click >> https://www.youtube.com/...4HrD_jst8VdGHjZHNqey
********************
Now, with bulb out of socket in question you'll see two nubs or maybe bands to contact the nubs of an 1157 bulb. With just parking lights on also called running lights noting other lights are on around the car ONE of those nubs inside the socket will light up the test light if it's powered AND you have found ground for your test light. Ground for your test light can be a bared, not all painted bolt, screw, body metal but not trunk lid but perhaps the latch where trunk lid latches to on main body of car or area.
Now if you don't have a helper to push brake pedal to turn on brake lights just turn ignition on to run for next test. Turn on directional to the side that works so you know key in ignition is in a correct spot. Now turn on side that is causing trouble and probe the other nub and it will light and probably even blink the test light. With brake it would just light the test light. If nothing make sure your ground is really good on the test light.
I'll try again for a picture of inside an 1157 bulb SOCKET without a bulb in it................
^^^^ That's not yours but shows the nubs in that picture I'm talking about
^^^^ I'll keep trying. You can see the nubs inside those that may look different than yours but work the same way. WARNING, WHEN TESTING WITH PROBE ONLY TOUCH PROBE TO THE NUB OR BAND INSIDE. IF SHAFT OF TEST LIGHT TOUCHES SIDE OF SOCKET OR A GROUND BAND INSIDE YOURS IT WILL BLOW THE FUSE - THAT WOULD BE A NORMAL MISTAKE AND NORMALLY WOULD BLOW A FUSE.
******************
OK - think those showed?
About techs costing something. If you must get a deal on this that anyone should be able to do or free I can't help more than I have and I AM FREE to you.
I don't know how you spliced in a new socket if this part is confusing you?
At some point if nothing is working out for you find a place. A trailer rental place would do if you ask for help testing a socket exactly U-Haul or a similar like them. An RV place. Anyone who does anything electrical home or vehicle - this is the smallest and easiest stuff you would generally encounter and fighting for a bargain isn't any help at all and anyone gouging is being a jerk unless something screwed up is found by a person helping you that should be done better or requires some more time and testing let them.
You should already have spent for a test light about $10 bucks or less, shrink tube package assortment ~$5 or so? Some unreal # of fuses already if not bought by the 100s are pricey so fixing this if a $100 bucks already would be a bargain!
Hope pics show and the video on the test light. You can use YouTube as well and find videos of what you want to do for many things and your search engine "Google" most popular but many ask for images which is what I did both Bing and Google.
These things are copyrighted or expired ads sometimes that just will NOT show up or last long. As I finish editing this if it shows for me it should show for you at least today.
Good luck. Knowing when you need help is also good knowledge on your part. Don't take it personally that you are not a trained tech in everything even this simple stuff to me buy maybe not you. So what? Dare I say none of the regulars here were born technically inclined? No - we learned it like people do about anything.
Ask away if I missed something but this is already about the longest post I've ever written!
Tom
(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Feb 9, 2016, 3:03 PM)
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ba_50
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Feb 10, 2016, 11:28 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Do you know where the ground wire is? I noticed the original left bulb was dimming more than the right one. If I could find the ground wire and clean it maybe that's all it would take.
(This post was edited by ba_50 on Feb 10, 2016, 11:39 AM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 10, 2016, 11:54 AM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Your socket new showed 3 wires didn't it? One is the ground wire and you should know now which one. It might share that with other side's bulbs - not sure.
It might just go off into a loom of wires before being grounded to body metal would be most common - which of many not known but seen around vehicles in general as a bare eyelet bolted to body metal, frame metal (you don't have a frame) or known grounded metal for lights could be inside trunk or elsewhere.
You should own a type of these by now.......Jumper wire with clips at ends........
You must be 100% sure of which wire is ground. You could look at where wires go into socket's back side and probably push a T pin in there or a needle and add known ground with the jumper clip wire hopefully with bulb in place would brighten up.
If fuse still blows there's too much power going to ground on that socket or wiring for a reason to be found that I don't know of any one way to find but a wire chase but still not consistent with it not blowing fuse if there isn't a bulb in the socket yet to me.
This has become much more trouble for you than it should be and a problem I'm not thinking of exists that I just never ran into on anything.
In short - you can add ground to what is known to be ground only as an extra or hunt for which one was intended specifically for that. Not even so sure a full wiring diagram would show you where just that it is grounded or wouldn't work or be able to blow a fuse. Dim does suggest it is lacking proper ground as you noticed and might be relying on wire all the way to other side.
IDK - not there to look. Pull back any carpet or trunk liner and just look for a ground wire with bare end and usually a small lag bolt to metal.
At some point this is giving you enough trouble it's time to send this problem out for help. It is a safety item that is supposed to work despite a high mount and the other side all should work as intended,
T
(This post was edited by Tom Greenleaf on Feb 10, 2016, 11:59 AM)
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ba_50
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Feb 12, 2016, 2:36 PM
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Re: 1985 ford ltd blows tail light fuse
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Ok I used a MM to test the socket wires and the black was a ground. Used a jumper off socket grd to grd and still blew a fuse. Must be something wrong with or at the end of the brown wire?
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Tom Greenleaf
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Feb 12, 2016, 3:44 PM
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Sport - We are wasting a lot of time. Doubt you've done or tested as I've suggested so time to send this out. Clearly it shorts at that socket ONLY WITH A BULB IN IT which you haven't verified so why are we bothering with this.
Get a tech to tend to it be done with it,
T
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