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Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure!


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Stormpainter
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May 14, 2017, 10:57 AM

Post #1 of 15 (594 views)
Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

Last night as I was pulling into my parking space in My 2001 Mitsubishi Mirage when it just stalled, I tried to Re-start it but instead it's making a sound almost like it's cranking with a distinct Whine but not starting! it does not sound like any bad starter I have heard! Actually I cant tell if it is the starter or not! One thing I do notice is, the Oil light is going out while cranking, which I believe usually indicates that the oil pump is pumping, I should also mention I am dealing with a somewhat bad head gasket, but it's not causing much trouble yet, Minimal temperature rises, and I don't think the engine Oil is full of coolant either! Any advice would be appreciated.


(This post was edited by Stormpainter on May 14, 2017, 11:05 AM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 14, 2017, 11:23 AM

Post #2 of 15 (579 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

Sounds like it's cranking but not: Has oil pressure so it is cranking. That because you stalled first and it sounds I'll say funny like no resistance to turn engine would usually be a broken timing belt! You didn't want to hear that.


What engine is in this thing? Most timing belts that totally snap or loose total valve timing for any reason will crash valves into pistons, bend them all up and it's so out of "valve timing" zero compression would feel like just that - easy to turn - way too easy for the starter would sound funny.


Damage is done if that. Try this - take a spark plug out and if you can turn engine by hand and feel for compression or put a compression tester on it just one mind you bet it reads or feels zero - no compression.


All done if so. From there it goes out unless you are VERY ready for this a head redo at a machine shop to fix or find out if usable to fix up and do a complete valve job plus the belt and all that goes with it depending on which engine on just that.


Get ready for a whopping expense or a ton of work on your part,


T



Stormpainter
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May 14, 2017, 12:16 PM

Post #3 of 15 (568 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

I guess that is a possibility! but I had the Timing Belt changed 2 years ago, original one lasted over 12 years! Also the car just stalled, No nasty Sounds no nothing! now it will not Start and it whines while cranking. Maybe I can peek under the Timing Belt Cover? It's a 1.8 Mitsubishi Engine.


(This post was edited by Stormpainter on May 14, 2017, 12:20 PM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 14, 2017, 12:26 PM

Post #4 of 15 (555 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

I can't know every layout of every engine. OK - you did the job or had it done but it failed I strongly think that's what's happening.
Just look at the engine while a helper cranks it as you've already done what ever damage happened. Watch lowest pulley turn with the starter - it's cranking by starter normally.


Hope I'm wrong but an example is a pull start plain lawnmower. You feel the compression of the engine while pulling but if you took the spark plug out it would just be one even pull - no resistance in that case but the puff coming out of a spark plug hole.


This belt on the car probably has side guides and runs from bottom to very top of the engine and may even run the water pump (not looking up all possible set ups) and if any of that stuff fails it's the same - belt can't hold valve timing broken or just so far off it wouldn't run and sound funny cranking it.


I told you to test for compression to prove me wrong then move on to what the problem really is. Both cranking which I'm pretty sure it does, not running after a stall and then the strange sound of a starter turning an engine with no or very little compression.
Your description of events and the sound plus not running is a lot to add up to something else new belt, on schedule or not. Hope not just too much adds up to that,


T



Hammer Time
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May 14, 2017, 1:08 PM

Post #5 of 15 (549 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

I agree with Tom. It sounds like it broke a timing belt. Do the compression test.



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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Tom Greenleaf
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May 14, 2017, 2:28 PM

Post #6 of 15 (542 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

Thought of a test without tools - just wet a rag and block tail-pipe. Nothing will be coming out like a usual putt-putt or puff-puff, T


Stormpainter
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May 14, 2017, 4:26 PM

Post #7 of 15 (525 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

I went the direct route and removed a plastic Timing belt cover, and the Belt is not broken! it is however riding on the far outer side of the Cams sprocket! I don't know what that means! ..it may have been installed like that? the engine is cranking, and the Cam is turning so it's definitely not the starter! I guess I'll start some basic tests for spark and fuel problems.


(This post was edited by Stormpainter on May 14, 2017, 5:45 PM)


Hammer Time
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May 14, 2017, 6:29 PM

Post #8 of 15 (505 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

Again, you need to do a compression test. The belt could have missing cogs and jumped timing. You have already determined there is something wrong with the belt. One of the pulleys or the water pump may have let go.

If any of those things happened, you'll be looking at a new engine or a big bill to repair that one.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Stormpainter
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May 14, 2017, 8:08 PM

Post #9 of 15 (496 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

And even though the belt is on there and turning the Cam, it could still be causing this noise and No starting?


Hammer Time
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Hammer Time profile image

May 14, 2017, 8:10 PM

Post #10 of 15 (488 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

Of course it could if it jumped time for any reason.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Discretesignals
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May 15, 2017, 6:34 AM

Post #11 of 15 (464 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

Any trouble codes stored in the PCM? If so, what are the numbers?





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Stormpainter
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May 15, 2017, 6:44 AM

Post #12 of 15 (457 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

What is the PCM and where would I look for Codes? also If I run a compression test for a possible timing jump, what results should I expect? and is it on any particular cylinder? This is a high mileage car 300K, with a head gasket thats leaking also.


Tom Greenleaf
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May 15, 2017, 9:00 AM

Post #13 of 15 (444 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

So now you add that info! How much do you think you can get out of this car if you did tons of work and still have a dependable car? IMO it was high miles at 1/2 that. There's tons more to a car/vehicle than just an engine that takes wear and tear just so long and so many miles.


Sure, go get codes read or have someone come to the car to read them if just by chance it's something simple but if you know and I'm not convinced it already needs a head gasket job which will mean a valve job the lower end of engine isn't going to behave after that by all odds this ends this car.


Who would buy a car with 300,000 miles on it if not for parts for another?


Maybe think more about cutting losses and looking for something else if even the same thing in outstanding shape with a history of care all along - this history isn't good again IMO,


T



Stormpainter
User

May 15, 2017, 9:37 AM

Post #14 of 15 (430 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

I'm just using this car to get around with, I don't expect to have all kinds of work done to it! and I mentioned in the beginning it has a HG leak! ..I just want to see what the the problem is, and if it will run again for a simple repair, or is it completely shot! ..If it is! I will have to get something newer!


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 15, 2017, 10:27 AM

Post #15 of 15 (422 views)
Re: Odd Sound When Cranking, Might Be Starter! But Not Sure! Sign In

How are you so sure in really needed a HG in the first place which would be redone if in fact timing belt is that far off now to not run if because of that I don't know of a cheap way out.


That might have been coolant leaking on the belt or something else - I don't think that's known.


There isn't much in what you've said that makes this seem like you can just put some cheap part in and it's all wonderful again.


The point I'm attempting now is difficult to know which is when to give up and quit putting good money into a lost cause from probably something else totally now.


It's always your call it's your car. I'm just saying to keep this legal and dependable if not just this is going to start getting out of control. Yes you may hear of vehicles that make it that many miles and more but they are totally rare and usually have insane care all along the way in every respect,


T







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