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99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing


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NaturalMysticATL
New User

May 6, 2012, 3:19 PM

Post #1 of 30 (6537 views)
99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Hi,

My 1999 Pontiac Grand Am GT 3.2L engine car will not start up smoothly and has been burning white smoke from behind the engine. The alternator is noisy.

What led up to this was that my car lost coolant. My thermostat did not indicate an overheat but when i stopped I heard an odd hiss noise from under the hood. I saw coolant leaking and felt hot air when I moved my hand over the reservoir.

I think the leak was from one of the small 3/8 hose clamps, but the next day the reservoir was dry so I replaced the reservoir, clamps, and topped off with fresh dexcool. My low coolant light never came on. I also have cleaned the coil heads and i cleaned the battery terminals and put some fresh dielectric grease in. I made some videos below that are on youtube to give you a better idea of exactly the noise:

Here is one with my engine knocking after I stopped driving, this was before I cleaned the corroded coil terminals:

http://youtu.be/lBsnttlSvJ0

I am not sure if this noise indicates engine damage...

Here is the alternator after I cleaned the coil terminals, it seems to be hissing:

http://youtu.be/ZaZzFbqwkr8

And the gem of them all here is the video I shot after driving for about 5 mins maybe 1/4 mile up the hill down the street, post coil clean:

http://youtu.be/ijFENA6kxGk

Is it dangerous to drive like this, what are your thoughts?


(This post was edited by NaturalMysticATL on May 6, 2012, 4:33 PM)


nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
nickwarner profile image

May 6, 2012, 3:54 PM

Post #2 of 30 (6498 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

First off, your engine is a 3.4. Second, thanks for posting vids and info properly. It helps. I want you to look at the front and rear of the engine where the intake meets the block (driver and pass sides since its sideways) and look for coolant coming out. If you can get a pressure tester on it thats the best way. These were known for intake leaks. Run the engine for a very short time with the belt off to be sure the noise you heard was from the accessory drive and not internal to the motor. If it is still there you have internal motor damage. Does the oil dipstick look milky? Does your coolant reservoir have oil in it?


NaturalMysticATL
New User

May 6, 2012, 4:33 PM

Post #3 of 30 (6484 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Whoops yeah thanks that's what I meant 3.4L. I don't see any coolant coming out there right now. I will try to see if I can get the pressure tester or get it tested. The oil dipstick did not seem milky but I think it had some coolant on it upon first check but not on recheck. I am not sure if my reservoir has oil in it but I have my old one still and it seems like it was pretty gunked up I guess with oil?

Here is a video of the old reservoir:

http://youtu.be/I2zvhx7VcNA

thanks again for the advice.


nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
nickwarner profile image

May 8, 2012, 2:33 PM

Post #4 of 30 (6399 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

For the symptoms you describe and the amount of sludge in that surge tank as well I think you're looking at a bad head gasket. These engines are notorious for them. If you choose to do the repair yourself make sure the heads get sent to a good machine shop for a look at them. Could have a small crack you won't see without their equipment and also the deck surface can get warped easily when the gasket fails. Always use good gaskets and new head bolts. Also, you absolutely must have a clean indoor work area with lots of light or you won't get this clean enough and will get a bunch of junk into the engine which will kill it very fast.


NaturalMystic
User

May 8, 2012, 2:51 PM

Post #5 of 30 (6398 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Hi Nick thanks for the information. I am not able to do this job but my car has been in this state since 2010. I fear I need the heads worked by this point. I appreciate your time & advice.


nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
nickwarner profile image

May 8, 2012, 3:02 PM

Post #6 of 30 (6395 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Hope it works out for you.


NaturalMystic
User

May 14, 2012, 7:23 PM

Post #7 of 30 (6356 views)
post icon Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

You were totally right, it is my head. You know my father always told me my head was not on quite right, lol haha I wish you could see me now, RIP Pop....and I have coolant in 2 of my cylinders (#1 & #3).

The shop will be checking the heads with their flat edge and I am asking them to put in an aluminum gasket. I will ask them to make sure to use new head bolts and I have heard when this type of damage happens that the catalytic converters must also be replaced. Will they check that normally or do you think I must ask them to?

I wonder if I have any other damage from the blown head. Could you advise on other things that I should be aware of or that I could ask the shop to check out while they have my beast in the cage for a few days?

Thanks again I cannot wait to get it back & I will post again with an update before and after!!


nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
nickwarner profile image

May 15, 2012, 3:02 PM

Post #8 of 30 (6343 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

No need to tell the shop to use new head bolts. If they are in business repairing cars they already know that. Honestly, techs hate customers telling them how to do their jobs. On occasion I have seen cats fail but usually not from this. To put a new one in automatically would be a waste of money. You can't tell if the cat is bad without being able to do readings on a running engine. I'd let them do their job and hopefully your bill won't be too harsh. On the upside, these motors had a lot of trouble with intake gaskets as well, and the parts stores sell what is called a "problem solver" kit which all shops buy. Since the heads came off the intake did too, and with new gaskets all around things should work out for your engine.


NaturalMystic
User

May 15, 2012, 11:56 PM

Post #9 of 30 (6328 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

I will wait to hear from them about the cat or any other problems they find once they have it up & in testable condition. I would never tell anyone how do to their jobs, although I do like to ask questions, so I will heed your advice. The head tech was kind enough to answer my questions. like that they use the metal gaskets regularly. I will personally thank the man who sent me to them, & I hope to be a customer's of theirs for many years to come. They came highly recommended & I saw they keep very busy. I am hopeful the bill will be just and I will try not to be so impatient and keep Cool & hope there are no cracks or any other damage that will lead me towards a different resolution & I will let you know how it all worked out in the end, thanks again for the advice & info. If they do a good job like I anticipate then I will be bringing them all of my cars for as long as I live in this area.


nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
nickwarner profile image

May 16, 2012, 6:35 PM

Post #10 of 30 (6314 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

If you have found a good shop that you trust I am certain it won't be the cheapest in the area. Good ones never are. But they will price reasonably compared to other places of like quality. Its always good to find a shop like that and bring all your work to them on two fronts. First, you have peace of mind that it was done properly and you get to know the guys working on your car. Second, it helps us when we have a regular that doesn't let other shops touch the car. We know the history of it, and we know the way it is driven by you. When you bring it to us for a routine service we know what we've fixed and what we haven't and look closely to be sure not only that our repairs are holding up well but to see any upcoming issues and alert you to them before it causes you to be stranded. Occasionally we may even botch something on a repair. We're only human. When you have a good working relationship with a good shop you will find them bending over backwards immediately to make it right. They want you to come back. Glad to hear things are looking good so far and looking forward to hearing the final verdict on everything.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 17, 2012, 11:09 AM

Post #11 of 30 (6305 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

So well said Nick. (No surprise) The joy of lower prices is long lost when all goes wrong because of incompetence or places or people that don't care. Go for quality as said as that's the real McCoy,

T

(bet McCoy sends folks to search what that means)



NaturalMystic
User

May 18, 2012, 8:27 PM

Post #12 of 30 (6291 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

I made a mistake when I wrote I would ask the shop to use metal gaskets, etc. I meant to say (and what I did do) was to ask the tech if that was what they used normally. I hope I didn't come off as a smart#$$ with those guys because they seem to be a good reputable shop with a hardworking crew.

Upon re-reading my previous reply I did not like the way I worded things online. I should have just asked how much it will cost and what they were doing.

Anyway I picked up the beast today. It was not cheap work but I think it was worth it. I would like to continue using them for everything, but they are not open on the weekend and I have another problem brewing.

Thermostat and starter were replaced. a bunch of gaskets replaced and I think I had some of the heads remachined / replaced and they did put in the new engine bolts.

When I went to drive off my check engine light was on. Luckily it was just a sensor being unplugged, and the tech did tell me to check the coolant levels in a few days.

A-ok well all that being said the engine seems to be running much better, but the temp. is still running hot enough for me to be concerned.

The coolant in my reservoir went from red color when I dropped it off to a mix of red and a slightly brown mostly watery color with a separation between the red and the watery brown - kind of like a salad dressing bottle, which I did not notice until I got home.

I am hoping if I get a coolant exchange or flush tomorrow that my car will run at normal temp. I would rather the repair shop did the flush or exchange, but I was not told that it needed such and unfortunately I do not have the free time to get back in there promptly for several days.

I hear conflicting info. about the coolant services. Is it true that a coolant drain is better than a coolant flush for an old car like mine, and is that the same as an engine flush service?

All in all I think they did good work and I do not expect any head gasket problem again for along time. I would like to use them for both of my cars and I am sure I will be back in there soon enough, but I am scratching my head about all the heat I have been experiencing lately...


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 19, 2012, 2:28 AM

Post #13 of 30 (6287 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

An old car! It's years newer than anything of my own! True!

Anti-freeze: There are three colors in wide use, Dexcool is a red, others are Green and some colorless. "Peak" used to make a blue one but haven't seen that in a while if it exists anymore at all.

No harm and in fact good to have it all fresh and nice to be one kind. Follow instructions on what you buy. This car no doubt came with Dexcool now made by other companies but should be red in color. Never exceed 50/50 unless you live in Point Barrow Alaska!

If you do this yourself just know that this stuff is poison and get rid of old stuff fast. Animals will drink it - game over! Check locally where to dispose of it. We need this product but it's not nice and I'm not some greeniac! Pretty much all of them are Ethylene-Glycol no matter the color. The additives are to protect against corrosion.

I'm surprised this wasn't done with the job? Are you having any overheating issues for real? Take it right back and bring that up! No to spend more of your money but it may need more work or perhaps a new radiator or something or you'll be right back where you started all over again.

The shops/techs don't and can't drive your car all day like you may to know every detail. Back when (retired) I always test drove a car with a repair that called for it such that a person didn't have an immediate problem and hoped to catch anything myself before a customer took the vehicle. Got all hell from two places for taking that time and quit at both places and opened my own shop!

How could it possibly please a customer, shop or the tech if things weren't just right? From the techs view some customers aren't fair. Just touching a vehicle doesn't make us responsible for every lurking problem a vehicle could have but some think that way so it's a two way street.

If there's a problem and seems so please bring that up as I think it wasn't noticed and may need something. Chances are just changing the antifreeze isn't going to fix it from running on the hot side. Nobody's fault so far but prevent more trouble now......

T



Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 19, 2012, 2:37 AM

Post #14 of 30 (6284 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

One more and a now post. Did you tend to noisy alternator? "Hissing" is not common to me anyway. Bearings can fail and make them noisy at first to a failure. Many times a whole replacement is the way to go but if a bearing (generally two in them) they can be done separately from the whole thing.

There are brushes that wear too and even a rebuilt one SHOULD have new ones. Whole noise could just be the belt even if new. Usually if you just spray some water on it and all is quiet it's the belt making troublesome noise,

Tom


NaturalMystic
User

May 19, 2012, 12:32 PM

Post #15 of 30 (6272 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

I really appreciate all of your expertise fellas. I am learning a lot, and luckily no one else had to touch the car. I called the 'lube shop" that was open today and asked about coolant colors.

They told me they use a universal type coolant that is cheaper than the red dexcool and it is a watery light brown color, so I am thinking the other shop just topped me off with some of that stuff. They said its universal so no need to worry about it not being dexcool. Not a fan of the dirty water look though..

As far as the alternator I am not hearing the growling noise but I will upload a video again here later so you can see the update. Lingering smell of gasket sealer compound when I open the cabin but it smells way better than burnt coolant!!

All in all I don't even think I really am running so hot. Temp is slightly elevated after driving around 20 mins, not getting into the red zone but I will keep an eye on it.

I will be taking it back to the good 'ole boys who got me right exclusively, totally worth the trip, time, and $$$!! Thanks again for your help I always appreciate professionals perspectives.


NaturalMystic
User

May 19, 2012, 2:14 PM

Post #16 of 30 (6265 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Here is the post work: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgHyW1f-Wcw&feature=youtu.be

The noise sounds much better after the repairs and it is running great, better than the rental car I had.. Sly

The beast is back!! Laugh


nickwarner
Veteran / Moderator
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May 19, 2012, 7:40 PM

Post #17 of 30 (6251 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Ther will be some crap that was in the block that will take some time to work itself out and will discolor the coolant. Your surge tank was also stained before from this. I would definately have them look at the temp issue to be sure its ok. If there is a problem, they will take care of it right away for you. It may be as simple as a bad gauge or sender. The gauge and the computer use different sensors for coolant temp, and its easy to plug a scanner in and watch the readings while using an IR pyro to confirm the readings of all. They just got a good bit of money and I'm sure will want to be sure your car is perfect. These engines do tend to get air pockets in them and don't always bleed out on the first try, which may be the case. Give them a call to let them know you'll be coming by, and do be sure you have the proper coolant level in the tank.


NaturalMystic
User

May 25, 2012, 4:12 PM

Post #18 of 30 (6236 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.2L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Well I may have spoke too soon about my car. Is it possible that some of the junk in the block could clog up my cat?

My car is now making a noise from underneath near the exhaust pipes, it sounds like a jet that is taxing on the runway. I am not sure what this is, but I wish I had wings right about now.

Even though I did ask about the cat I dont know that I can be mad at the shop, since this noise just started, but I believe someone more knowledgeable about cars than I had told me I will need a new CAT based on my gasket problems.

To be honest I cannot say this is the CAT. My check engine light is not on, but the car is still running slightly hot. I am hoping it just a loose pipe or something.

Here is the video that I just uploaded:
http://youtu.be/LB2rUimZXvg


(This post was edited by NaturalMystic on May 25, 2012, 5:31 PM)


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 25, 2012, 6:44 PM

Post #19 of 30 (6224 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

YouTube link didn't show anything about cars? This current noise could be an exhaust noise exacerbated by a plugged converter which can be diagnosed as plugged, working or not. In the course of work any weak links could have been strained or perhaps a crack in a pipe before the converter somehow in a way it makes tons of noise.

Do you have expected power back and now just the noise? Exhaust most likely and system must flex some just for torque on the engine on its mounts so that's a weak area that can go bad.

a 99 should be able to set a code if converter isn't working or overtaxed. Most seem to burn up from unburned fuel trying to hard to convert it to less harmful emissions.

How hot is it running now? Run heater full blast and see if that brings it down suggestive of inadequate radiator or fan issue among things that can cause an engine to run hot along with low coolant level.

May need someone to listen to this in person if you can't see some flaw obviously,

T



Discretesignals
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May 25, 2012, 6:49 PM

Post #20 of 30 (6220 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

I hear a loud fuel pump in the video and what sounds like a plastic bag getting sucked into a vacuum cleaner.

The video before it I could see where someone used a crap pot load of silicone sealant on the bypass pipe connection. You don't have to use sealant on that because it has an o ring. Hope they didn't do that on the intake gaskets too. Seen sealant plug up steam holes in the head gaskets because someone got carried away with the sealant.

It also sounds like the engine is surging.





Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.

(This post was edited by Discretesignals on May 25, 2012, 6:57 PM)


NaturalMysticc
New User

May 26, 2012, 12:52 AM

Post #21 of 30 (6206 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Youtube was not much help but I did see how to replace a catalytic converter & of course the pro make it look so easy.

I did not notice a lack of power going uphill but the car was running so bad before that it may be relative. Coolant level seems good but I noticed it was running around 220 after 20-30 mins driving time & last time I had the heat cranked it did lower the temp. some. I have a code reader I can dig out and see if it gives me any info, but my check engine light is not currently on.

As far as the fuel pump I had it replaced about 3 or 4 years ago. I have noticed in the week I had my car back is a bit of a squeal on start up, and that noise went away after driving for a few minutes. I had a similar noise before and it tended to get worse after time and did not go away, and that time it was the serpentine belt. I checked but the belt looks dry and undamaged so far.

I don't know what to think about the engine surge but I do also notice that the cabin still smells strongly of sealant when I open it to get in.

I am not sure what they did to the intake gaskets but the mechanic told me when they were testing after the repairs that my wires melted (?!) so they put in a new starter and he said they replaced the wires but apparently they did not charge me for the wires and the spark plug wires looked like my old ones so I am not sure what to think about that either unless he was talking about some other wires.

Do you think it is dangerous to drive it like this? I wish the shop was closer and open on Saturday...THanks for your time.


Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 26, 2012, 3:19 AM

Post #22 of 30 (6199 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In


Quote
As far as the fuel pump I had it replaced about 3 or 4 years ago.


Sooooo..... That doesn't mean a thing.

The second you start assuming something is good just because it's been replaced before is when you really start wasting a lot of money and time going in the wrong direction.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.



Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 26, 2012, 3:52 AM

Post #23 of 30 (6195 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

There are enough parts bad out of the box new.

"Is this safe to drive" -- not sure what the wiring issue was so couldn't guess

Temp of 220 is probably OK if no warnings by car's own gauge and who knows how accurate they are? Most seem close,

T



NaturalMystic
User

May 26, 2012, 7:43 AM

Post #24 of 30 (6185 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

Yeah thanks I am guessing the temp. is decent but there is absolutely something else wrong with it.

I understand parts fail even brand new & I have had to replace some of them repeatedly, like the serp. belt many many times but I dont remember my fuel pump making a noise like this before when it was failing.

I am just not very happy right now, I put a boatload into this lovely car and now it has another problem less than one week later.


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
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May 26, 2012, 8:03 AM

Post #25 of 30 (6181 views)
Re: 99 Grand Am 3.4L won't start, engine smokes, alternator hissing Sign In

If really fuel pump noise and have heard bad ones buzz away but wouldn't call it like a jet engine but who knows? Sometimes for no real mechanical reason problems come in waves. Suks and makes you and me wonder whether to keep going or cut losses which only you can decide,

T







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