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2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking


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Whitewolf3755
New User

Oct 23, 2016, 8:03 PM

Post #1 of 8 (325 views)
  post locked   post icon 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

I am baffled by this problem...
I have a 2002 Toyota Tundra, 2 wheel drive, 4.7 L V-8, without an ABS system, that was optional on that truck and don't have it.
I replaced, on both sides, wheel seals, brake shoes, and drums. Also replaced a short brake line from left wheel to the top of deferential and did all the bleeding properly.
When I apply the brakes, the truck shakes, kinda jumpy, but not so much in the first mile after sitting awhile. Gets worse when warmed up a little. Strange...
Thought I might have gotten warped drums so I took them back and got a 2nd new pair. Same problem.
Don't see any leaks, visually checked all my work and looks good as best as I can tell. Never had an issue like this before. Anyone have ideas?
Thanx!


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Oct 23, 2016, 10:00 PM

Post #2 of 8 (318 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

More questions/notes for this job:
*What did the old shoes look like one side vs the other?
* Parking brake? Does it work properly and free when OFF?
* Larger shoe or one with more lining towards rear? If mixed up - NG - they'll misbehave.
* What about wheel cylinders and hardware? You said oil seals - why?


*****************
Things at large: Check for a bent axle could also be a reason for needing grease/oil seals. If rusty enough to need a brake line it probably needed all new hardware, the wheel cylinders and maybe even a new backing plate?
How did you adjust the shoes for this when done? Common mistakes are doing it by parking cable not at each wheel by its automatic adjuster if not new doesn't work. Those almost never work a second round well - any style of them.


If these are not free as can be just hoisted off ground or spinning drum with other rear wheel up as well, in neutral any rubbing when you add weight will apply more pressure via parking brake which is only set once service brakes are perfect or unending troubles. Any an all adjustments must be done in order or it will domino along and ruin the other adjustment. Parking brake must be last and even better if left on the loose side if it needed touching at all or if messed with before which it really shouldn't normally need will then need to be set for the new drums now an OE size not redone/turned. In fact turning a drum is about off my suggested list totally as it changes the size of the friction area where shoes will contact it for many, many miles of use usually.


A must check: Both or all u-joints! Yes - when rear end is braking the differential housing torques the other way from power or neutral and puts rear u-joint in new spot for the unseen needle bearings. Have to really drop driveshaft (index it for same spot to put back on) and feel the joint. No roughness or binding at all. Should flop either way or caps turn 100% freely.


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The big note is drum brakes are directional and "asymmetrically opposite" from one another. If parts put on - hardware, shoes or adjustments not proper they'll drag or grab, make heat and feel warped.
Again: Axle and drum to axle relationship has to be true and know it or any adjustment will mess up.


Hit back with info as it's two sets of new drums with same issue so giving you a hard time,


T



kev2
Veteran
kev2 profile image

Oct 24, 2016, 6:12 AM

Post #3 of 8 (310 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

are we SURE its a rear brake problem - could front be the issue?


Whitewolf3755
New User

Oct 24, 2016, 7:41 PM

Post #4 of 8 (291 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

I'll do my best to answer and reply. The initial issue/reason for replacing wheel seals was that drivers side was leaking, evidence all over inside of tire.
Decided to replace brake shoes and drums partly because of gear oil all over, but brake shoes were getting thinish anyway.
My son twisted the brake line in two so had to replace that, no rust or corrosion issue there.
I adjusted the brakes with the little wheel between the shoes, didn't use parking brake, but I think I need to double check adjustment and make sure its right. Maybe one side is tighter than other? Also feel like it wouldn't hurt to bleed brakes again just in case. Strange that it doesn't act up during the first mile after sitting all night.
You said "If these are not free as can be just hoisted off ground or spinning drum with other rear wheel up as well, in neutral any rubbing when you add weight will apply more pressure via parking brake which is only set once service brakes are perfect or unending troubles." I'm not following you there, sorry.
Also checked u-joints, front end, front brakes, all seems well there.
Thank you very much for the time you are putting in trying to help!


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Oct 25, 2016, 12:27 AM

Post #5 of 8 (281 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

OK - It's almost impossible to relay the relationship of parking brake and the service brake. So many have been screwed up that putting on new parts CAUSES the problem now so you start over first with proper setting of the shoes and adjusted - no rubbing free turning but real close. Should be able to adjust with and have to with wheel back on and tightened up.


If you hoisted by frame the parking brake with be tighter than it should be when you put it down and don't know it so get warm fast when driven and will shake.


With that part applied the brake isn't anchored properly so is all confused how to work normally anymore.


Cables may not be fully retracted and must retract all the way before you do any brake work or the job is hopeless. You have to know that FIRST before touching it and correct where it's wrong if at all and know it.


This is the way a brake for rear wheels has been done since hydraulic brakes were put in use vs rods and cables only. The people who understand it start to finish are all long out of working this stuff or alive at all. Simple as an erector set if you even recall those and bet you don't.


This stymies the pros never mind DIY folks but all makes sense when you see things work in sequence for adjustments.


Why did axle seal leak? Have you found out why and how do you know a good u-joint from a bad one already? It's a 2002 - great if not rusty but all of these things have to be right FIRST then you can take on the brake replacement.


Along its life it probably had a redo once or more - can't know that or what got messed up before you so you have to know and set it all straight and know it is or this is what happens.


The pull force of just the return springs needs to be new each time you change out shoes and hope it's right. That stuff is cheap but will ruin new work but might have worked with all the old stuff.


You noticed this with a axle leak on one side and need to know why it did that. Do you know how to check it axle is bent?


These are simple but intolerant of mistakes. Twisting up an unrusted line suggests there isn't proper equipment being used plus lack of knowing that's common and how to avoid it and is NOT the cause now just delay.


What do you wish to do? You haven't found the source of the problem so nothing is going to work until you find that then move on. Get help if need be or send it out now as you really can't fake this and it come out right.


Been brought up if the issue is the rear brakes at all and not sure you really know or not on just that either,


T



Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Hammer Time profile image

Oct 25, 2016, 4:19 AM

Post #6 of 8 (278 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

I hope you replaced the bearing along with the seal. Those seals don't just go for no reason. The bearing is usually the root cause.



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Whitewolf3755
New User

Nov 13, 2016, 8:59 PM

Post #7 of 8 (230 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

I have an update... Several experienced mechanics have said they really think the drums were out of round. Not likely I would get two new sets from different locations, Autozone, and have the same problem, but I had the drums turned and for $20, the problem is solved! Brakes work perfectly! And the machine shop said they knew they were out of round right away by the sound of the lathe. Crazy! So glad its fixed and thanks again for your time here.
Alan


Tom Greenleaf
Ultimate Carjunky / Moderator
Tom Greenleaf profile image

Nov 13, 2016, 10:45 PM

Post #8 of 8 (224 views)
  post locked   Re: 2002 Toyota Tundra rear brakes shaking  

Appreciate you taking the time to post that it's fixed and what was found. I'll close out thread as solved. YOU may ask any mod to re-open it upon request,
T







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